EP166 Interview With Mark & Simon From Elinchrom UK

I sit down with Mark Cheatham and Simon Burfoot from Elinchrom UK to talk about the two words that matter most when you work with light: accuracy and consistency. We dig into flash vs. continuous, shaping light (not just adding it), why reliable gear shortens your workflow, and Elinchrom’s new LED 100 C—including evenly filling big softboxes and that handy internal battery. We also wander into AI: threats, tools, and why authenticity still carries the highest value.

 

Links:

• Elinchrom UK store/info: https://elinchrom.co.uk/

• LED 100 C product page: https://elinchrom.co.uk/elinchrom-led-100-c

• Rotalux Deep Octa / strips: https://elinchrom.co.uk/elinchrom-rotalux-deep-octabox-100cm-softbox/

• My workshop dates: https://masteringportraitphotography.com/workshops-and-mentoring/

Transcript:

Paul: as quite a lot of, you know, I've had a love affair with Elinchrom Lighting for the past 20 something years. In fact, I'm sitting with one of the original secondhand lights I bought from the Flash Center 21 years ago in London.

And on top of that, you couldn't ask for a nicer set of guys in the UK to deal with. So I'm sitting here about to talk to Simon and Mark from Elinchrom uk.

I'm Paul and this is the Mastering Portrait Photography podcast.

Paul: So before we get any further, tell me a little bit about who you are, each of you and the team from Elinchrom UK

Mark: After you, Simon.

Simon: Thank you very much, mark.

Mark: That's fine.

Simon: I'm, Simon Burfoot. I have, been in the industry now for longer than I care to think.

35 years almost to the, to the day.

Always been in the industry even before I left school because my father was a photographer and a lighting tutor, working for various manufacturers I was always into photography, and when he started the whole lighting journey. I got on it with him, and was learning from a very young age.

Did my first wedding at 16 years old. Had a Saturday job which turned into a full-time job in a retail camera shop. By the time I was 18, I was managing my own camera shop, in a little town in the Cotswolds called Cirencester. My dad always told me that to be a photographic rep in the industry, you needed to see it from all angles, to get the experience.

So I ended up, working in retail, moving over to a framing company. Finishing off in a prolab, hand printing, wedding photographers pictures, processing E6 and C41, hand correcting big prints for framing for, for customers, which was really interesting and I really enjoyed it. And then ended up working for a company called Leeds Photo Visual, I was a Southwest sales guy for them.

Then I moved to KJP before it became, what we know now as Wex, and got all of the customers back that I'd stolen for them for Leeds. And then really sort of started my career progressing through, and then started to work with Elinchrom, on the lighting side. Used Elinchrom way before I started working with them.

I like you a bit of a love affair. I'd used lots of different lights and, just loved the quality of the light that the Elinchrom system produced. And that's down to a number of factors that I could bore you with, but it's the quality of the gear, the consistency in terms of color, and exposure.

Shooting film was very important to have that consistency because we didn't have Photoshop to help us out afterwards. It was a learning journey, but I, I hit my goal after being a wedding photographer and a portrait photographer in my spare time, working towards getting out on the road, meeting people and being involved in the industry, which I love.

And I think it's something that I'm scared of leaving 'cause I dunno anything else. It's a wonderful industry. It has its quirks, its, downfalls at points, but actually it's a really good group of people and everyone kind of, gets on and we all love working with each other.

So we're friends rather than colleagues.

Paul: I hesitate to ask, given the length of that answer, to cut

Simon: You did ask.

Mark: I know.

Paul: a short story

Mark: was wondering if I was gonna get a go.

Paul: I was waiting to get to end into the podcast and I was about to sign off.

Mark: So, hi Mark Cheatham, sales director for Elinchrom uk this is where it gets a little bit scary because me and Simon have probably known each other for 10 years, yet our journeys in the industry are remarkably similar.

I went to college, did photography, left college, went to work at commercial photographers and hand printers. I was a hand printer, mainly black and white, anything from six by four to eight foot by four foot panels, which are horrible when you're deving in a dish. But we did it.

Paul: To the generation now, deving in a dish doesn't mean anything.

Simon: No, it doesn't.

Mark: And, and when you're doing a eight foot by four foot print and you've got it, you're wearing most of the chemistry. You went home stinking every night. I was working in retail. As a Saturday lad and then got promoted from the Saturday lad to the manager and went to run a camera shop in a little town in the Lake District called Kendall.

I stayed there for nine years. I left there,

went on the road working for a brand called Olympus, where I did 10 years, I moved to Pentax, which became Rico Pentax. I did 10 years there. I've been in the industry all my life. Like Simon, I love the industry.

I did go out the industry for 18 months where I went into the wonderful world of high end commercial vr, selling to blue light military, that sort of thing. And then came back. One of the, original members of Elinchrom uk. I don't do as much photography as Simon I take photos every day, probably too many looking at my Apple storage. I do shoot and I like shooting now and again, but I'm not a constant shooter like you guys i'm not a professional shooter, but when you spent 30 odd years in the industry, and part of that, I basically run the, the medium format business for Pentax. So 645D, 645Z.

Yeah, it was a great time. I love the industry and, everything about it. So, yeah, that's it

Paul: Obviously both of you at some point put your heads together and decided Elinchrom UK was the future. What triggered that and

why do you think gimme your sales pitch for Elinchrom for a moment and then we can discuss the various merits.

Simon: The sales pitch for Elinchrom is fairly straightforward. It's a nice, affordable system that does exactly what most photographers would like. We sell a lot of our modifiers, so soft boxes and things like that to other users, of Prophoto, Broncolor. Anybody else? Because actually the quality of the light that comes out the front of our diffusion material and our specular surfaces on the soft boxes is, is a lot, lot more superior than, than most.

A lot more superior. A lot more

Mark: A lot more superior.

Paul: more superior.

Simon: I'm trying to

Paul: Superior.

Simon: It's superior. And I think Paul, you'll agree,

Paul: it's a lot more,

Simon: You've used different manufacturers over the years and, I think the quality of light speaks for itself.

As a photographer I want consistency. Beautiful light and the effects that the Elinchrom system gives me, I've tried other soft boxes. If you want a big contrasty, not so kind light, then use a cheaper soft box.

If I've got a big tattoo guy full of piercings you're gonna put some contrasty light to create some ambience. Maybe the system for that isn't good enough, but for your standard portrait photographer in a studio, I don't think you can beat the light.

Mark: I think the two key words for Elinchrom products are accuracy and consistency. And that's what, as a portrait photographer, you should be striving for, you don't want your equipment to lengthen your workflow or make your job harder in post-production.

If you're using Elinchrom lights with Elinchrom soft boxes or Elinchrom modifiers, you know that you're gonna get accuracy and consistency. Which generally makes your job easier.

Paul: I think there's a bit that neither of you, I don't think you've quite covered, and it's the bit of the puzzle that makes you want to use whatever is the tool of your trade.

I mean, I worked with musicians, I grew up around orchestras. Watching people who utterly adore the instrument that's in their hand. It makes 'em wanna play it. If you own the instrument that you love to play, whether it's a drum kit a trumpet a violin or a piano, you will play it and get the very best out of your talent with it.

It's just a joy to pick it up and use it for all the little tiny things I think it's the bit you've missed in your descriptions of it is the utter passion that people that use it have for it.

Mark: I think one of the things I learned from my time in retail, which was obviously going back, a long way, even before digital cameras One of the things I learned from retail, I was in retail long before digital cameras, retail was a busier time.

People would come and genuinely ask for advice. So yes, someone would come in and what's the best camera for this? Or what's the best camera for that? Honestly there is still no answer to that. All the kit was good then all the kit is good now. You might get four or five different SLRs out.

And the one they'd pick at the end was the one that they felt most comfortable with and had the best connection with. When you are using something every day, every other day, however it might be, it becomes part of you. I'm a F1 fan, if you love the world of F1, you know that an F1 car, the driver doesn't sit in an F1 car, they become part of the F1 car.

When you are using the same equipment day in, day out, you don't have to think about what button to press, what dial to to turn.

You do it.

And that, I think that's the difference between using something you genuinely love and get on with and using something because that's what you've got. And maybe that's a difference you genuinely love and get on with Elinchrom lights. So yes, they're given amazing output and I know there's, little things that you'd love to see improved on them, but that's not the light output.

Paul: But the thing is, I mean, I've never, I've never heard the F1 analogy, but it's not a bad one.

When you talk about these drivers and their cars and you are right, they're sort of symbiotic, so let's talk a little bit about why we use flash. So from the photographers listening who are just setting out, and that's an awful lot of our audience. I think broadly speaking, there are two roads or three roads, if you include available light if you're a portrait photographer.

So there's available light. There's continuous light, and then there's strobes flash or whatever you wanna call it. Of course, there's, hybrid modeling and all sorts of things, but those are broadly the three ways that you're gonna light your scene or your subject. Why flash? What is it about that instantaneous pulse of light from a xenon tube that so appealing to photographers?

Simon: I think there's a few reasons. The available light is lovely if you can control it, and by that I mean knowing how to use your camera, and control the ambient light. My experience of using available light, if you do it wrong, it can be quite flat and uninteresting.

If you've got a bright, hot, sunny day, it can be harder to control than if it's a nice overcast day. But then the overcast day will provide you with some nice soft, flat lighting. Continuous light is obviously got its uses and there's a lot of people out there using it because what they see is what they get.

The way I look at continuous light is you are adding to the ambient light, adding more daylight to the daylight you've already got, which isn't a problem, but you need to control that light onto the subject to make the subject look more interesting. So a no shadow, a chin shadow to show that that subject is three dimensional.

There are very big limitations with LED because generally it's very unshapable. By that I mean the light is a very linear light. Light travels in straight lines anyway, but with a flash, we can shape the light, and that's why there's different shapes and sizes of modifiers, but it's very difficult to shape correctly -an LED array, the flash for me, gives me creativity. So with my flash, I get a sharper image to start with. I can put the shadows and the light exactly where I want and use the edge of a massive soft box, rather than the center if I'm using a flash gun or a constant light. It allows me to choose how much or how little contrast I put through that light, to create different dynamics in the image.

It allows me to be more creative. I can kill the ambient light with flash rather than adding to it. I can change how much ambient I bring into my flash exposure.

I've got a lot more control, and I'm not talking about TTL, I'm talking about full manual control of using the modifier, the flash, and me telling the camera what I want it to do, rather than the camera telling me what it thinks is right.

Which generally 99% of the time is wrong. It's given me a beautiful, average exposure, but if I wanted to kill the sun behind the subject, well it's not gonna do that. It's gonna give me an average of everything. Whereas Flash will just give me that extra opportunity to be a lot more creative and have a lot more control over my picture.

I've got quite a big saying in my workshops. I think a decent flash image is an image where it looks like flash wasn't used. As a flash photographer, Paul, I expect you probably agree with me, anyone can take a flash image. The control of light is important because anybody can light an image, but to light the subject within the image and control the environmental constraints, is the key to it and the most technical part of it.

Mark: You've got to take your camera off P for professional to do that. You've got to turn it off p for professional and get it in manual mode. And that gives you the control

Paul: Well, you say that,

We have to at some point. Address the fact that AI is not just coming, it's sitting here in

our studios all the time, and we are only a heartbeat away from P for professional, meaning AI analyzed and creating magic.

I don't doubt for a minute. I mean, right now you're right, but not

Mark: Well, at some point it will be integrated into the camera

Paul: Of course it will.

Mark: If you use an iPhone or any other phone, you know, we are using AI as phone photographers, your snapshots. You take your kids, your dogs, whatever they are highly modified images.

Paul: Yeah. But in a lot of the modern cameras, there's AI behind the scenes, for instance, on the focusing

Mark: Yeah.

Paul: While we've, we are on that, we were on that thread.

Let's put us back on that thread for a second. What's coming down the line

with, all lighting and camera craft with ai. What are you guys seeing that maybe we're not

Simon: in terms of flash technology or light technology?

Paul: Alright. I mean, so I mean there's, I guess there's two angles, isn't there?

What are the lights gonna do that use ai? What are the controllers gonna do, that uses ai, but more importantly, how will it hold its own in a world where I can hit a button and say, I want rebrand lighting on that face. I can do that today.

Mark: Yeah.

Simon: I'm not sure the lighting industry is anywhere near producing anything that is gonna give what a piece of software can give, because there's a lot more factors involved. There's what size light it is, what position that light is in, how high that light is, how low that light is.

And I think the software we've all heard and played with Evoto we were talking about earlier, I was very skeptical and dubious about it to start with as everybody would be. I'm a Photoshop Lightroom user, have been for, many years. And I did some editing, in EEvoto with my five free credits to start with, three edits in, I bought some credits because I thought, actually this is very, very good.

I'll never use it for lighting i'd like to think I can get that right myself. However, if somebody gives you a, a very flat image of a family outside and say, well, could you make this better for me? Well, guess what? I can do whatever you like to it. Is it gonna attack the photographer that's trying to earn a living?

I think there's always a need for people to take real photographs and family photographs. I think as photographers, we need to embrace it as an aid to speed up our workflow. I don't think it will fully take over the art of photography because it's a different thing.

It's not your work. It's a computer generated AI piece of work in my head. Therefore, who's responsible for that image? Who owns the copyright to that image? We deal with photographers all the time who literally point a camera, take a picture and spend three hours editing it and tell everyone that,

look at this. The software's really good and it's made you look good. I think AI is capable of doing that to an extent. In five years time, we'll look back at Evoto today and what it's producing and we'll think cracky. That was awful. It's like when you watch a high definition movie from the late 1990s, you look at it and it was amazing at the time, but you look at it now and you think, crikey, look at the quality of it.

I dunno if we're that far ahead where we won't get to that point. The quality is there. I mean, how much better can you go than 4K, eight K minus, all that kind of stuff. I'm unsure, but I don't think the AI side of it. Is applicable to flash at this moment in time? I don't know.

Mark: I think you're right.

To look at the whole, photography in general. If you are a social photographer, family photographer, whatever it might be, you are genuinely capturing that moment in time that can't be replaced.

If you are a product photographer, that's a different matter. I think there's more of a threat.

I think I might be right in saying.

I was looking, I think I saw it on, LinkedIn. There is a fashion brand in the UK at the moment that their entire catalog of clothing has been shot without models.

When you look at it on the website, there's models in it. They shoot the clothing on mannequins and then everything else is AI generated they've been developing their own AI platform now for a number of years. Does the person care Who's buying a dress for 30 quid?

Probably not, but if you are photographing somebody's wedding, graduation, some, you know, a genuine moment in someone's life, I think it'd be really wrong to use any sort of AI other than a little bit of post-production, which we know is now quite standard for many people in the industry.

Paul: Yeah, the curiosity for me is I suspect as an industry,

Guess just released a full AI model advert in, Vogue. Declared as AI generated an ai agency created it. Everything about it is ai. There's no real photography involved except in the learning side of it.

And that's a logical extension of the fact we've been Photoshopping to such a degree that the end product no longer related to the input. And we've been doing that 25 years. I started on Photoshop version one, whatever that was, 30 years More than 33.

So we've kind of worked our way into a corner where the only way out of it is to continue.

There's no backtracking now.

Mark: Yeah.

Paul: I think the damage to the industry though, or the worry for the industry, I think you're both right. I think if you can feel it, touch it, be there, there will always be that importance. In fact, the provenance of authenticity. Is the high value ticket item now,

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: because you, everything else is synthetic, you can trust nothing. We are literally probably months away from 90% of social media being generated by ai. AI is both the consumer and the generator of almost everything online

Mark: Absolutely.

Paul: Goodness knows where we go. You certainly can't trust anything you read. You can't trust anything you see, so authenticity, face-to-face will become, I think a high value item.

Yeah.

Mark: Yeah.

Paul: I think one problem for us as an industry in terms of what the damage might be is that all those people that photograph nameless products or create books, you know, use photography and then compositing for, let's say a novel that's gone, stock libraries that's gone because they're faceless.

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: there doesn't have to be authentic. A designer can type in half a dozen keywords. Into an AI engine and get what he needs. If he doesn't get what he needs, he does it again. All of those photographers who currently own Kit are gonna look around with what do we do now?

And so for those of us who specialize in weddings and portraits and family events, our market stands every chance of being diluted, which has the knock on effect of all of us having to keep an eye on AI to stay ahead of all competitors, which has the next knock on effect, that we're all gonna lean into ai, which begs the question, what happens after Because that's what happened in the Photoshop world.

You know, I'm kind of, I mean, genuinely cur, and this will be a running theme on the podcast forever, is kind of prodding it and taking barometer readings as to where are we going?

Mark: Yeah. I mean, who's more at threat at the moment from this technology?

Is it the photographer or is it the retouch? You know, we do forget that there are retouchers That is their, they're not photographers.

Paul: I don't forget. They email me 3, 4, 5 times a day.

Mark: a

Simon: day,

Mark: You know, a highly skilled retouch isn't cheap. They've honed their craft for many years using whatever software product they prefer to use.

I think they're the ones at risk now more so than the photographer. And I think we sort of lose sight of that. Looking at it from a photographer's point of view, there is a whole industry behind photography that actually is being affected more so than you guys at the moment.

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: Yeah, I think there's truth in that, but. It's not really important. Of course, it's really important to all of those people, but this is the digital revolution that we went through as film photographers, and probably what the Daguerreotype generators went through when Fox Tolbert invented the first transfer.

Negative. You know, they are, there are always these epochs in our industry and it wipes out entire skillset.

You know, I mean, when we went to digital before then, like you, I could dev in a tank.

Yeah. You know, and really liked it. I like I see, I suspect I just like the solitude,

Mark: the dark,

Paul: red light in the dark

Mark: yeah.

Paul: Nobody will come in.

Not now. Go away. Yeah. All that kind of stuff. But of course those skills have gone, has as, have access to the equipment.

I think we're there again, this feels like to me a huge transition in the industry and for those who want to keep up, AI is the keeping up whether you like it or not.

Mark: Yeah. And if you don't like it, we've seen it, we're in the middle of a massive resurgence in film photography,

which is great for the industry, great for the retail industry, great for the film manufacturers, chemical manufacturers, everything.

You know, simon, myself, you, you, we, we, our earliest photography, whether we were shooting with flash, natural light, we were film shooters and that planes back.

And what digital did, from a camera point of view, is make it easier and more accessible for less skilled people.

But it's true. You know, if you shot with a digital camera now that's got a dynamic range of 15 stops, you actually don't even need to have your exposure, that accurate Go and shoot with a slide film that's got dynamic range of less than one stop and see how good you are.

It has made it easier. The technology, it will always make it. Easier, but it opens up new doors, it opens up new avenues to skilled people as well as unskilled people. If you want, I'm using the word unskilled again, I'm not being, a blanket phrase, but it's true. You can pick up a digital camera now and get results that same person shooting with a slide film 20 years ago would not get add software to that post-production, everything else.

It's an industry that we've seen so many changes in over the 30 odd years that we've been in it,

Simon: been

Mark: continue

Simon: at times. It exciting

Mark: The dawn of digital photography to the masses. was amazing.

I was working for Olympus at the time when digital really took off and for Olympus it was amazing. They made some amazing products. We did quite well out of it and people started enjoying photography that maybe hadn't enjoyed photography before.

You know, people might laugh at, you know, you, you, you're at a wedding, you're shooting a really nice wedding pool and there's always a couple of guests there which have got equipment as good as yours. Better, better than yours. Yeah. Got

Simon: jobs and they can afford it.

Mark: They've got proper jobs. Their pitches aren't going to be as good as yours.

They're the ones laughing at everyone shooting on their phone because they've spent six grand on their new. Camera. But if shooting on a phone gets people into photography and then next year they buy a camera and two years later they upgrade their camera and it gets them into the hobby of photography?

That's great for everyone. Hobbyists are as essential, as professional photographers to the industry. In fact, to keep the manufacturers going, probably more so

Simon: the hobbyists are a massive part. Even if they go out and spend six or seven or 8,000 pounds on a camera because they think it's gonna make them a better photographer. Who knows in two years time with the AI side, maybe it will. That old saying, Hey Mr, that's a nice camera.

I bet it takes great pictures, may become true. We have people on the lighting courses, the workshops we run, the people I train and they're asking me, okay, what sessions are we gonna use? And I'm saying, okay, well we're gonna be a hundred ISO at 125th, F 5.6. Okay, well if I point my camera at the subject, it's telling me, yeah, but you need to put it onto manual.

And you see the color drain out their faces. You've got a 6,000 pound camera and you've never taken it off 'P'.

Mark: True story.

Simon: And we see this all the time. It's like the whole TTL strobe manual flash system. The camera's telling you what it wants to show you, but that maybe is not what you want.

There are people out there that will spend a fortune on equipment but actually you could take just as good a picture with a much smaller, cheaper device with an nice bit of glass on the front if you know what you're doing. And that goes back to what Mark was saying about shooting film and slide film and digital today.

Paul: I, mean, you know, I don't want this to be an echo chamber, and so what I am really interested in though, is the way that AI will change what flash photography does.

I'm curious as to where we are headed in that, specific vertical. How is AI going to help and influence our ability to create great lip photography using flash?

Mark: I think,

Paul: I love the fact the two guys side and looked at each other.

Mark: I,

Simon: it's a difficult question to answer.

Mark: physical light,

Simon: is a difficult question to answer because if you're

Mark: talking about the physical delivery of light.

Simon: Not gonna change.

Mark: Now,

The only thing I can even compare it to, if you think about how the light is delivered, is what's the nearest thing?

What's gotta change? Modern headlamps on cars, going back to cars again, you know, a modern car are using these LED arrays and they will switch on and switch off different LEDs depending on the conditions in front of them. Anti dazzle, all this sort of stuff. You know, the modern expensive headlamp is an amazing technical piece of kit.

It's not just one ball, but it's hundreds in some cases of little arrays. Will that come into flash? I don't know. Will you just be able to put a soft box in front of someone and it will shape the light in the future using a massive array. Right? I dunno it,

Simon: there's been many companies tested these arrays, in terms of LED Flash,

And I think to be honest, that's probably the nearest it's gonna get to an AI point of view is this LED Flash.

Now there's an argument to say, what is flash if I walk into a living room and flick the light on, on off really quickly, is that a flash?

Mark: No, that's a folock in

Paul: me

Mark: turn, big lights off.

Paul: Yeah.

Mark: So

Simon: it,

you, you might be able to get these arrays to flush on and off. But LED technology, in terms of how it works, it's quite slow.

It's a diode, it takes a while for it to get to its correct brightness and it takes a while for it to turn off. To try and get an LED. To work as a flash. It, it's not an explosion in a gas field tube. It's a a, a lighter emitting diode that is, is coming on and turning off again. Will AI help that? Due to the nature of its design, I don't think it can.

Mark: Me and s aren't invented an AI flash anytime soon by the looks of, we're

Simon: it's very secret.

Mark: We're just putting everyone off Paul,

Simon: It's alright.

Mark: just so they don't think

Simon: Yeah,

Mark: Oh, it's gonna be too much hard work and we'll sort it.

Paul: It's definitely coming.

I don't doubt for a minute that this is all coming because there's no one not looking at anything

Simon: that makes perfect sense.

Paul: Right now there's an explosion of invention because everybody's trying to find an angle on everything.

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: The guys I feel the most for are the guys who spent millions, , on these big LED film backdrop walls.

Simon: Yep.

Mark: So you can

Paul: a car onto a flight sim, rack, and then film the whole lot in front of an LED wall. Well, it was great. And there was a market for people filming those backdrops, and now of course that's all AI generated in the LED, but that's only today's technology.

Tomorrow's is, you don't need the LED wall.

That's here today. VEO3 and Flow already, I mean, I had to play with one the other day for one of our lighting diagrams and it animated the whole thing. Absolute genius.

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: I still generated the original diagram.

Mark: Yeah,

Paul: Yeah, that's useful. There's some skill in there still for now, but, you gotta face the music that anything that isn't, I can touch it and prod it. AI's gonna do it.

Mark: Absolutely. If you've ever seen the series Mandalorian go and watch the making of the Mandalorian and they are using those big LED walls, that is their backdrop.

Yeah. And it's amazing how fast they shift from, you know, they can, they don't need to build a set. Yeah. They shift from scene to scene.

Paul: Well, aI is now building the scenes. But tomorrow they won't need the LED wall. 'cause AI will put it in behind the actors.

Mark: Yeah. Say after

Paul: that you won't need the actors because they're being forced to sign away the rights so that AI can be used. And even those that are standing their ground and saying no, well, the actors saying Yes. Are the ones being hired.

You know, in the end, AI is gonna touch all of it. And so I mean, it's things like, imagine walking into a studio. Let's ignore the LED thing for a minute, by the way, that's a temporary argument,

Simon: I know you're talking about.

Paul: about today's,

Simon: You're about the.

Mark: days

Paul: LEDs,

Simon: we're in, We're in very, very interesting times and. I'm excited for the future. I'm excited for the new generation of photographers that are coming in to see how they work with what happens.

We've gone from fully analog to me selling IMACON drum scanners that were digitizing negatives and all the five four sheet almost a shoot of properties for an estate agent were all digitized on an hassle blood scanner. And then the digital camera comes out and you start using it. It was a Kodak camera, I think the first SLRI used,

Paul: Yeah.

Simon: and you get the results back and you think, oh my God, it looks like it's come out of a practica MTL five B.

Mark: But

Simon: then suddenly

the technology just changes and changes and changes and suddenly it's running away with itself and where we are today. I mean, I, I didn't like digital to start with. It was too. It was too digital.

It was too sharp. It didn't have the feel of film, but do you know what?

We get used to it and the files that my digital mirrorless camera provide now and my Fuji GFX medium format are absolutely stunning. But the first thing I do is turn the sharpness down because they are generally over sharp. For a lovely, beautifully lit portrait or whatever that anybody takes, it just needs knocking back a bit.

We were speaking about this earlier,

I did some comparison edits from what I'd done manually in Photoshop to the Evoto. Do you know what the pre-selected edits are? Great. If you not the slider back from 10 to about six, you're there or thereabouts?

More is not always good.

Mark: I think when it comes to imagery in our daily lives,

the one thing that drives what we expect to see is TV and most people's TVs, everything's turned up to a hundred.

The color, the contrast, that was a bit of a shock originally from the film to digital, crossover. Everything went from being relatively natural to way over the top

Just getting back to AI and how it's gonna affect people like you and people that we work with day to day.

I don't think we should be worried about that. We should be worried about the images we see on the news, not what we're seeing, hanging on people's walls and how they're gonna be affected by ai.

That generally does affect everyone's daily life.

Paul: Yeah,

Mark: Yeah. But what

Paul: people now ask me, for instance, I've photographed a couple head shots yesterday, and the one person had not ironed her blouse.

And her first question was, can we sort that out in post? So this is the knock on effect people are becoming aware of what's possible.

What's that? Nothing.

Know, and the, the smooth clothing button in Evoto will get me quite a long way down that road and saves somebody picking up an eye and randomly, it's not me, it's now actually more work for me 'cause I shouldn't have to do it.

But, you know, this

is my point about the knock on effect. Our worlds are different. So I didn't really intend this to be just a great sort of circular conversation about AI cars and, future technology. It was more, I dunno, we ended up down there anyway.

Simon: We went down a rabbit hole.

Mark: A

Paul: rabbit hole.

Yeah

Mark: was quite an interesting one.

Simon: And I'm sorry if you've wasted your entire journey to work and we

Paul: Yeah.

Simon: Alright. It wasn't intended to be like that.

Paul: I think it's a debate that we need to be having and there needs to be more discussion about it. Certainly for anybody that has a voice in the industry and people are listening to it because right now it might be a toddler of a technology, but it's growing faster than people realize.

There is now a point in the written word online where AI is generating more than real people are generating, and AI is learning that. So AI is reading its own output. That's now beginning to happen in imagery and film and music.

Simon: Well,

even in Google results, you type in anything to a Google search bar. When it comes back to the results, the first section at the top is the AI generated version. And you know what, it's generally

Paul: Yep.

Simon: good and

Paul: turn off all the rest of it now. So it's only ai.

Simon: Not quite brave enough for that yet. No, not me.

Mark: In terms

Paul: of SEO for instance, you now need to tune it for large language models.

You need to be giving. Google the LLM information you want it to learn so that you become part of that section on a website. And it, you know, this is where we are and it's happening at such a speed, every day I am learning something new about something else that's arriving. And I think TV and film is probably slightly ahead of the photography industry

Mark: Yeah.

Paul: The pressures on the costs are so big,

Simon: Yes.

Paul: Whereas the cost differential, I'm predicting our costs will actually go up, not down.

Whereas in TV and film, the cost will come down dramatically.

Mark: Absolutely.

Simon: They are a horrifically high level anyway. That's

Paul: I'm not disputing that, but I watched a demo of some new stuff online recently and they had a talking head and they literally typed in relight that with a kiss light here, hairlight there, Rembrandt variation on the front.

And they did it off a flat picture and they can move the lights around as if you are moving lights. Yes. And that's there today. So that's coming our way too. And I still think the people who understand how to see light will have an advantage because you'll know when you've typed these words in that you've got it about right.

It doesn't change the fact that it's going to be increasingly synthetic.

The moment in the middle of it is real. We may well be asked to relight things, re clothe things that's already happening.

Simon: Yeah.

Paul: We get, can you just fill in my hairline? That's a fairly common one.

Just removing a mole. Or removing two inches round a waist. This, we've been doing that forever.

Simon: Mm-hmm.

Paul: And so now it'll be done with keyword generation rather than, photoshop necessarily.

Simon: I think you'll always have the people that embrace this, we can't ignore it as you rightly say.

It's not going away. It's gonna get bigger, it's gonna feature more in our lives.

I think there's gonna be three sets of people. It's gonna be the people like us generally on a daily basis. We're photographers or we're artists. We enjoy what we do. I enjoy correctly lighting somebody with the correct modifier

properties to match light quality to get the best look and feel and the ambience of that image. And I enjoy the process of putting that together and then seeing the end result afterwards. I suppose that makes me an artist in, in, in loose terms. I think, you know, as, as, as a photographer, we are artists.

You've then got another generation that are finding shortcuts. They're doing some of the job with their camera. They're making their image from an AI point of view. Does that make up an artist? I suppose it still does because they're creating their own art, but they have no interest 'cause they have no enjoyment in making that picture as good as it can be before you even hit the shutter. And then I think you've got other people, and us to an extent where you do what you need to do, you enjoy the process, you look at the images, and then you just finely tune it with a bit of AI or Photoshop retouching

so I think there are different sets of people that will use AI to their advantage or completely ignore it.

Mark: Yeah. I think you're right. And I think it comes down, I'm going to use another analogy here, you, you know, let's say you enjoy cooking. If you enjoy cooking, you're creating something. What's the alternative? You get a microwave meal.

Well, Paul

Simon: and Sarah do.

Mark: No.

Paul: Sarah does.

Simon: We can't afford waitress.

Mark: You might spend months creating your perfect risotto.

You've got it right.

You love it. Everyone else loves it. You share it around all your friends. Brilliant. Or you go to Waitrose, you buy one, put it three minutes in the microwave and it's done.

That's yer AI I Imagery, isn't it? It's a microwave meal.

Paul: There's a lot of microwave meals out there. And not that many people cook their own stuff and certainly not as many as used to. And there's a lesson.

Simon: Is,

Mark: but also,

Simon: things have become easier

Mark: there

Simon: you go.

Mark: I think what we also forget in the photographic industry and take the industry as a whole, and this is something I've experienced in the, in the working for manufacturers in that photography itself is, is a, is a huge hobby.

There's lots of hobbyist photographers, but there's actually more people that do photography as part of another hobby, birdwatching, aviation, all that sort of thing. Anything, you know, the photography isn't the hobby, it's the birds that are the hobby, but they take photographs of, it's the planes that are the hobby, but they take photographs.

They're the ones that actually keep the industry going and then they expand into other industries. They come on one of our workshops. You know, that's something that we're still and Simon still Absolutely. And yourself, educating photographers to do it right, to

practice using the gear the right way, but the theory of it and getting it right.

If anything that brings more people into wanting to learn to cook better,

Paul: you

Mark: have

more chefs rather than people using microwave meals. Education's just so important. And when it comes to lighting, I wasn't competent in using flash. I'm still not, but having sat through Simon's course and other people's courses now for hundreds of times, I can light a scene sometimes,

people

are still gonna be hungry for education.

I think some wills, some won't. If you wanna go and get that microwave risotto go and microwave u risotto. But there's always gonna be people that wanna learn how to do it properly, wanna learn from scratch, wanna learn the art of it.

Creators and in a creative industry, we've got to embrace those people and bring more people into it and ensure there's more people on that journey of learning and upskilling and trying to do it properly.

Um, and yes, if they use whatever technology at whatever stage in their journey, if they're getting enjoyment from it, what's it matter?

Paul: Excellent.

Mark: What a fine

Paul: concluding statement. If they got enjoyment outta it. Yeah. Whatever. Excellent. Thank you, Mark, for your summing up.

Simon: In conclusion,

Paul: did that just come out your nose?

What on earth.

Mark: What

Paul: what you can't see, dear Listener is the fact that Mark just spat his water everywhere, laughing at Si.

It's been an interesting podcast. Anyway, I'm gonna drag this back onto topic for fear of it dissolving into three blokes having a pint.

Mark: I think we should go for one.

Simon: I think,

Paul: I think we should know as well.

Having said that with this conversation, maybe not. I was gonna ask you a little bit about, 'cause we've talked about strobes and the beauty of strobes, but of course Elinchrom still is more than that, and you've just launched a new LED light, so I know you like Strobe Simon.

Now talk about the continuous light that also Elinchrom is producing.

Simon: We have launched the Elinchrom LED 100 C. Those familiar with our Elinchrom One and Three OCF camera Flash system. It's basically a smaller unit, but still uses the OCF adapter.

Elinchrom have put a lot of time into this. They've been looking at LED technology for many years, and I've been to the factory in Switzerland and seen different LED arrays being tested. The problem we had with LEDs is every single LED was different and put out a different color temperature.

We're now manufacturing LEDs in batches, where they can all be matched. They all come from the same serial number batch. And the different colors of LED as well, 15 years ago, blue LEDs weren't even possible. You couldn't make a blue LED every other color, but not blue for some unknown reason.

They've got the colors right now, they've got full RGB spectrum, which is perfectly accurate a 95 or 97 CRI index light. It's a true hundred watts, of light as well. From tosin through to past daylight and fully controllable like the CRO flash system in very accurate nth degrees.

The LED array in the front of the, the LEDA hundred is one of the first shapeable, fully shapeable, LED arrays that I've come across and I've looked at lots.

By shapeable, I mean you put it into a soft box, of any size and it's not gonna give you a hotspot in the middle, or it's not gonna light the first 12 inches of the middle of the soft box and leave the rest dark.

I remember when we got the first LD and Mark got it before me

And he said, I've put it onto a 70 centimeter soft box. And he said, I've taken a picture to the front. Look at this. And it was perfectly even from edge to edge. When I got it, I stuck it onto a 1 3 5 centimeter soft box and did the same and was absolutely blown away by how even it was from edge to edge.

When I got my light meter out, if you remember what one of those is, uh, it, uh, it gave me a third of a stop different from the center to the outside edge. Now for an LED, that's brilliant. I mean, that's decent for a flash, but for an LED it's generally unheard of. So you can make the LED as big as you like.

It's got all the special effects that some of the cheaper Chinese ones have got because people use that kind of thing. Apparently I have no idea what for. But it sits on its own in a market where there are very cheap and cheerful LEDs, that kind of do a job. And very expensive high-end LEDs that do a completely different job for the photographer that's gone hybrid and does a bit of shooting, but does a bit of video work.

So, going into a solicitor's or an accountant's office where they want head shots, but also want a bit of talking head video for the MD or the CEO explaining about his company on the website. It's perfect. You can up the ISO and use the modeling lamp in generally the threes, the fives, the ones that we've got, the LEDs are brilliant.

But actually the LED 100 will give you all your modifier that you've taken with you, you can use those. It's very small and light, with its own built-in battery and it will give you a very nice low iso. Talking head interview with a lovely big light source.

And I've proved the point of how well it works and how nice it is at the price point it sits in. But it is our first journey into it. There will be others come in and there'll be an app control for it. And I think from an LED point of view, you're gonna say, I would say this, but actually it's one of the nicer ones I've used.

And when you get yours, you can tell people exactly the same.

Paul: Trust me,

I will.

Simon: Yes.

Mark: I think

Paul: very

excited about it.

Mark: I think the beauty

of it as well is it's got an inbuilt battery.

It'll give

you up to 45 minutes on a full charge.

You can plug it in and run it off the mains directly through the USB socket as well. But it means it's a truly portable light source. 45 minutes at a hundred watt and it's rated at a hundred watt actual light output. It's seems far in excess of that.

When you actually,

Simon: we had a photographer the other day who used it and he's used to using sort of 3, 2 50, 300 watt LEDs and he said put them side by side at full power.

They were virtually comparable.

Paul: That is certainly true, or in my case by lots.

Simon: I

seem to be surrounded

Paul: by Elinchrom kit,

Which is all good. So for anybody who's interested in buying one of these things, where'd you get them? How much are they?

Simon: The LED itself, the singlehead unit is 499 inc VAT.

If you want one with a charger, which sounds ridiculous, but there's always people who say, well, I don't want the charger. You can have one with a charger for 50 quid extra. So 549. The twin kit is just less than a thousand quid with chargers. And it comes in a very nice portable carry bag to, to carry them around in.

Um, and, uh, yeah, available from all good photographic retailers, and, Ellen crom.co uk.

Paul: Very good. So just to remind you beautiful people listening to this podcast, we only ever feature people and products, at least like this one where I've said, put a sales pitch in because I use it.

It's only ever been about what we use here at the studio. I hate the idea of just being a renta-voice.

You it.

Mark: bought it.

Paul: Yeah. That's true. You guys sold it to me.

Mark: Yeah,

Simon: if I gave you

anything you'd tell everyone it was great. So if you buy it, no, I've bought

Paul: Yeah. And

then became an ambassador for you. As with everything here, I put my money where my mouth is, we will use it. We do use it. I'm really interested in the little LED light because I could have done with that the other night. It would've been perfect for a very particular need. So yes, I can highly recommend Elinchrom Fives and Threes if you're on a different system.

The Rotalux, system of modifier is the best on the planet. Quick to set up, quick to take down. More importantly, the light that comes off them is just beautiful, whether it's a Godox, whether it's on a ProPhoto, which it was for me, or whether if you've really got your common sense about you on the front of an Elinchrom.

And on that happy note and back to where we started, which is about lighting, I'm gonna say thanks to the guys. They came to the studio to fix a problem but it's always lovely to have them as guests here. Thank you, mark. Thank you Simon. Most importantly, you Elinchrom for creating Kit is just an absolute joy to use.

If you've enjoyed the podcast, please head over to all your other episodes. Please subscribe and whatever is your podcast, play of choice, whether it's iTunes, Spotify, YouTube, or a other. After you head, if you head across to masteringportraitphotography.com the spiritual home of this, particular, podcast, I will put in the show notes all the little bits of detail and where to get these things.

I'll get some links off the guys as to where to look for the kit. Thank you both. I dunno when I'll be seeing you again. I suspect it will be the Convention in January if I know the way these things go.

Simon: We're not gonna get invited back, are we?

Mark: Probably not. Enough.

Paul: And I'm gonna get a mop and clean up that water. You've just sprayed all over the floor.

What is going on?

Simon: wish we'd video. That was a funny sun

Mark: I just didn't expect it and never usually that sort of funny and quick,

Simon: It's the funniest thing I've ever seen.

Paul: On that happy note, whatever else is going on in your lives, be kind to yourself. Take care.

This one starts with a dodgy lane choice, a Starbucks coffee, and a misjudged underpass. As always.

I’m back in the Land Rover — which might be its final podcast outing before it finds a new home — and today’s episode is a rambling, reflective road trip through customer service, creative resilience, and the rapidly growing presence of AI in our industry.

The day started badly. Cold shower (thanks British Gas), broken editing software, and a head full of terabytes. But it ended with a reminder of why kindness, craftsmanship, and conversation still matter. A haircut from someone I’ve known for 18 years. A deep chat with the owner of Michel Engineering while he lovingly took apart my ancient-but-beautiful record deck — the very same design featured in A Clockwork Orange and owned by Steve Jobs, no less. And then... a disappointing interaction with a distracted barista and a headset-wearing drive-thru operator. Same building, worlds apart.

Customer service, it turns out, is alive and well — just not always where you'd expect it.

But the main theme of this episode is AI. Not the doom-and-gloom kind, but the real stuff: the tools I’m already using, how they’re reshaping our workflows, and how they might be reshaping entire economies. It’s not AI that’s coming for your job — it’s the photographer who learns to harness it.

We talk about:

• AI tools I already use (like EVOTO, Imagine AI, ChatGPT, and XCi)

• Using AI as a teaching assistant, sub-editor, and productivity coach

• The real-world implications of AI-generated ads, coding layoffs, and what it means for creatives

• Plans for a new AI section on masteringportraitphotography.com

And if you hang in there until the end, I’ll tell you about a girl named Dory, a gutsy 12-year-old contortionist, and the new edition of Mastering Portrait Photography — complete with fresh images, a decade of stories, and a very special launch offer.

So pop on your headphones, admire the wheat fields if you’ve got them, and come along for the ride.

Spoiler: there’s C3PO’s eye in here too. Yes, really.

 

🛠️ Mentioned in this episode:

• Michel Engineering (Turntables) – michelengineering.com

• EVOTO.AI – AI portrait retouching evoto.ai

• Imagine AI – Smart colour-matching editing imagine.ai

• XCi (Excire) – AI-powered image search: excire.com

• ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini – AI tools for writing, reasoning, and workflow

• DaVinci Resolve – Subtitle generator and video editor: blackmagicdesign.com

• ACDSee – Image management software: acdsee.com

---

📘 Book Update: Mastering Portrait Photography (Updated Edition)

• Publication date: September 14, 2025

• Pre-order now with 25% off at Waterstones: Waterstones Offer Link (search "Mastering Portrait Photography Summer Offer")

• Signed copies: Will be available via masteringportraitphotography.com

---

🎓 Workshops & Mentoring

• Workshops now back on Mondays (not Fridays!)

• One-to-one mentoring now available — contact the studio for more info

• Explore workshops: masteringportraitphotography.com/workshops-and-mentoring

Transcript

Introduction and Setting the Scene

Well, as you can probably gather from the noise going on in the background I'm back out in the Land Rover, uh, for one more podcast out on my travels. Um, you'll have to bear with me as I navigate the carpark away from Starbucks. Uh, it's been an interesting day in so many, so many ways, and I will talk about all of that.

 

Uh, where do I, where do I start? Right? Well, I'm back out on the road. Maybe one of the last ones. 

 

Memorable Cars and the Land Rover

 

The Land Rover is, as many of you know, now up for sale and not because I don't absolutely love this vehicle. It is by far, by far and away my favorite car that I've ever owned, and I've owned some cars that I have truly loved.

 

Of course, my first car, an Austin Allegro affectionately named nicknamed Benny, as in Benny from Top Cat. Um, because it's small, bubbly, and round. Um, I owned a Mark two Ford Escort with a steering wheel so small you could touch your thumbs across it, but an engine so small that it really wasn't a sports car, but that was just a beautiful thing.

 

I've owned a Lexus IS 200, which. From a speed freak point of view is a lot more lively than even this Land Rover is, but in the end. This four wheel drive farmer's vehicle has traveled with me all over the uk from job to job, from client to client. And even today as I was visiting, uh, a place to get my record deck repaired, which I will tell you about, the guy that owns the company came out and all he could do, in spite of the fact we're looking at one of the rarest record decks around.

 

In spite of that, all he could do was talk about the Land Rover. I'm Paul, and this is the Mastering Portrait Photography  📍 podcast.

 

 Oh, do you know what I've just done? You know, when you get in a lane, because there's a roundabout coming that I have to turn right at. So I got in a lane and now I'm in an underpass going underneath the roundabout. That I needed to turn right at. How that's really frustrating. I hate it when that happens.

 

However, I'm up in Hichin, uh, Stevenage way, um, in the southeastern ish corner of the uk. Weirdly enough, I've been here before. I thought I recognized it. This is where I photographed Kevin Fong in the, um, British Aerospace. It looks like it's now Airbus here. I've just driven past the lab where we photograph Kevin Fong on the moon, on the Mars Lander.

 

A test area. So they've built, it's like the size of a football pitch or two. It's huge. This huge great expanse of sand and rocks, and they've lit it like the light would be on Mars. I don't know. Why that would be important if you are testing Moon Lands or Mars lands. I haven't a clue. Uh, but it's where they tested, uh, or at least the British scientists tested their parts of the Mars rover and things.

 

I've been here before. I photographed here. Uh, that's not why I here this particular moment. Uh, but I wanna start. Oh, there it is. Look at that. How cool. Sorry. This is way Yeah. Home of the exo Mars rover. I've been in there. Wow. Some days, some days ev well, every day is an adventure. Some days more than others.

 

Right? Now, let's see me, let's see if I can get into the underpass the right way around this time, having turned around to head back home, mop it. 

 

Navigating the Day and Customer Service

 

Um, I wanted to talk about a few things today, but one of the things that came up, which wasn't meant to really, so this is now gonna be a two part podcast. Let me talk about customer service first.

 

And it starts yesterday. Really, let me tell you a bit of my day yesterday. Not if I'm honest, my best day and we all have them. So the upshot is, everything worked out and I have the photographs I needed or I need, but getting there proved trickier than it does normal. And that's in spite of the fact that I talk in.

 

Very good story ab about being present and giving it your all. So the day started fairly badly with a cold shower. The boiler broke, well, it broke the night before. Actually it broke on Sunday night. So I got on the bike, did some exercise, sweated a lot, went to have a nice, warm, refreshing shower and had, well, it was a refreshing shower, but a cold one.

 

It was, I mean, I know they say a cold shower is meant to be good for you, not for me. Alright. It left me in a crappy mood and knowing I had to get in touch with British gas, um, the week before British acid service, the boiler, now it's broken. So you can imagine, as much as I'm trying to be stoic and sensible about these things, I'm really quite cross.

 

Uh, I try my best not to take it out on those around me. I took it out on those around me, uh, and to all those people around me, I do apologize. And by that I mean predominantly Sarah, who takes the, the brunt of all of my crappy moods when they happen. Uh, thankfully it doesn't happen too often, uh, but when they happen, it is always Sarah that's in the firing line.

 

So, um, after trolling through the website and trying to get an engineer booked, that was no good. They couldn't bring, couldn't send anyone out till. Tuesday or they said they couldn't send anyone out to Tuesday. Let me just navigate this Range Rover that's creeping on my inside. Thank you. Um, so, uh, yesterday morning, Monday morning, um, I got on the phone to talk to someone.

 

I thought, do you know what I'll do instead of trying to use computer systems, I'll talk to someone. Well, uh, I talked to a computer. I said, yes, no, no, yes. And, uh, punched in my credit card details because in spite of the fact the engineer probably broke the boiler. Um, we still have to have a credit card ready for any excess.

 

Now, the upshot is quite a good one, is that by calling in, I did mostly get a, an appointment far earlier than I could do on their website, which doesn't really make any sense given that on the website, I'm assuming it is plugged into exactly the same. Booking system that the automated voice was in case you in any doubt?

 

No. I didn't get to speak to a human. I got to speak to a very, very poor AI or automated something or other. Anyway, so that was the start of the day. Then in the office, Katie's machine running Da Vinci stopped talking to Frame io. Now for those of you into it, da Vinci is our editing suite, any videos and Frame io is where we store our assets.

 

Now this isn't ideal if the editing suite can't talk to the asset store. That's the end of a day's work, really. So that put me in a fairly bad mood. And then we're gonna be photographing three amazing kids. So we're doing a video on siblings. Why you photograph them, how you photograph them, the laughter involved in photographing them.

 

And we've got this amazing family, three teenagers and uh, they were due in and sure enough, they arrived and I still had my head inside. What do I do if Da Vinci no longer talks to Frame io? We're gonna have to re-license a load of stuff. I'm gonna have to move a couple of terabytes of assets around, which as anyone who's done it knows it's.

 

Probably, you know, a week's worth of work for me. Um, everything was just piling up and I was struggling to get my head into it. And of course they're teenagers and they're excited about coming into the studio, and I wanted to give them the best. Experience. I can, even though they're not here as a client, they have been as a client before, but they're not here as a client.

 

They're here because I would like to create a video about photographing siblings. So I owe it to them in so many ways to give the very best of me. And I was struggling. And I think in reality, probably for about an hour, I struggled to get myself into that zone where you are creating. Beautiful pictures.

 

The light wasn't light, I didn't feel great. My head is spinning because I think I've got days of work ahead of me to fix something else. Um, got there Eventually we did get both the photographs and the video ready to create, uh, another one of our mastering portrait photography videos this time on photographing siblings, how to approach it, what to look for, things you can do.

 

And then on top of that, some top tips for top Tip Tuesday on our socials. But it's really important when it comes to the service levels. At the end of the day, their customers and I offer our customer service, and that has an interesting run on into today. So today, so far, what time is it? It is quarter to one.

 

I've been on the road since about quarter past eight this morning, so I went for a haircut first. Our reg, my regular hairstylist, who I've been going to for 18 years, we worked out this morning. I photographed her wedding 18 years ago, and I'd known her a little bit before then when I pitched for the work and did a prew wedding shoot.

 

So 18, 19 years, I've been going to cap for a haircut and we chat shit. I mean, we just. Laugh and talk nonsense sometimes. Sometimes really serious stuff. 'cause she's got kids. I've got kids different ages, but you know, we've lived through similar things. I've watched her business grow and change over the years.

 

She's worked with me, I've worked with her. And I would say that her customer service is some of the best I've ever met. There's only her now. She did run a multi, a multi station, um, uh, salon for ages, but in the end decided that she would rather just work on her own, have a nice, steady, um, client base, um, who she knew and does very well, that which has a client at home.

 

But in spite of that, or maybe because of that, her customer service is absolutely brilliant as long as you don't try to text her late in the evening. We might get quite a short answer. 

 

The Record Deck Repair Adventure

 

And then today I've been over to get my record deck serviced. Now the kids have been on at me for about, about this for a few years now.

 

It's been broken. Um, and it came to a head this Father's Day when they said, what would I like? And I thought, well, find me a record or something. And they both went, no. And I'm like, sorry, what? They said, we're not buying you anymore records until you fix your flipping record deck because it's been broken for so long.

 

And you'd said you're gonna get it fixed and you haven't. So we're no longer buying your records. Now that's not to say I didn't get some really cool gifts from them, but it did sort of, okay, I take your point. Let me go get this sorted. So I rang in to the company that originally made it so a bit of history.

 

The record deck is a transcripter hydraulic reference turntable. The company was called Transcripter. Um, it's the same age as I am. It's a beautiful, beautiful thing. It's glass and aluminum and big brass weights, soft belt drive. You can still get from the same company. A record deck that is derived from it called the Gyro.

 

It's worth thousands and thousands of pounds. Um, their decks. This deck isn't worth anything until it works. And then. Probably is worth a thousand pounds. If anyone has watched Stanley Kubrick's Clockwork Orange, then he will recognize the deck because it's that record deck. He won a design award in about 1967, I think, and he's still got the little British Design Award sticker on the lid, on the, the plastic, sorry, the Perspex cover.

 

It's all original. It was built by the company. I've just visited Michel Engineering and they make these most incredible, beautiful record decks. Now, I rang in a couple of weeks ago and they said, look, we haven't got any slots for service for a few weeks. Um, ringing again on the 24th of July, which I did.

 

So I rang on the 24th. Um, as it happened, it was Steven who owns Michel Engineering now, um, who picked up, I chatted to him and he's. When can you bring it in? So I said today, um, I'm on the road. Um, so why not bring it in on today, Tuesday? So, um, I brought it in, um, the most incredible service. Uh, I obviously, I didn't carry it to the door 'cause I didn't really know which one of the industrial units I was headed to.

 

So I buzzed it as it happened. It was Steven, um, opened the door and I told him who I was and he said, oh, put you in. And I said, oh great. And he said, no, no, I'll come with you. So we went over to the Land Rover where I parked up. First thing he does, I admire the Land Rover, which always makes you feel good.

 

Um, which followed up quite quickly with me by saying, it's you, it's up for sale. Um, and a chat there about pricing. Who knows? You never know, do you? Anyway, he admired the Land Rover, so I'm feeling better already. So I opened up the boot and there's obviously my record deck, this transcript, uh, hydraulic reference to the table.

 

And he's obviously seen a few of these, but he said, oh, that's a, that's an old one, that's an original. And I went to pick it up and he said, no, no, I'll carry it. Don't worry. So he picked it up outta the Land Rover and I locked it up. We took it into the service lab where it sits now amongst a few similar ones, some newer ones, well all newer ones.

 

Um, we took it apart or he took it apart and had a look at the different components. Um, puffed his cheeks out a little bit, which is always good when you're talking to an engineer. It's a bit like when you take your car into a garage and they go, oh mate, ah, your rings. But he was very affectionate, very respectful of the record deck, and it was built pre 1972.

 

And the way he knows that is there's no serial number on it because before 19. 72. They didn't put serial numbers on him, so he's got this very old turntable that my dad bought in. I think it was about 19 81, 82. He paid 15 pounds worth 15 of your British pounds at a jumble sale. Well, this deck is worth anywhere between 1500 quid and two and half thousand pounds of today's money secondhand.

 

Um, so my dad actually did pretty well. Uh, I dunno if he realized what he'd bought. It didn't work, which is why it was only 15 quid. But my dad attacked it with a soldier line. Probably the same things I've now got to have repaired this time. But he took all the bits off and he showed me how it worked and he explains it in detail.

 

And we just got chatting. We got chatting to the point where when I come back to pick up the record deck, Steven has very kindly agreed to come on the podcast because we talked about quality, we talked about the love of vinyl, which to an extent, I, I have a nostalgia for vinyl, but I don't have a particularly sophisticated, um, sense of hearing.

 

So I can't pick out the details that probably their guys can. But I appreciate the engineering and of course it was my dad. So now somebody who cares about it probably as much as I. Who is looking after it is gonna fix the bits that are not right. And given it was a gift from my dad to me for my 40th birthday, it was built around about the same year that I was born.

 

My dad bought it for 15 quid and absolutely loved it. And now it's in the hands of the company who built it. The very first company though, is his father who set up the company. There's this whole set of layers to the story that are gonna add even more love to it, even more passion for listening to records that the kids have bought me on it, and the service that they offer is so personable and so knowledgeable.

 

I couldn't help but just get excited. I got excited just walking in. By the time I left, he showed me this room. They've got a room downstairs with some of their legacy, Michelle. It's called M-I-C-H-E-L-L, Michelle Turntables and Michelle. And they've done all sorts of things over the years, not least of which is to create C3 PO's eyes.

 

No kid, you not, uh, my joy hit the floor when he was telling me he said, yeah, you know, it's based on some stuff we already had in some odd bins. And because it was all made round here where I'm driving the original Star Wars was actually filmed all around this area, Borum Wood, um, and Stevenage in West London.

 

And so the guys who were doing the special effects used to just hunt round OddBins around all the industrial states. They found some off cuts of something that was, I dunno what it was, a bit of a record deck I think. And hoed them out and modified them and they became C3 PO's eyes. I've literally just been eye to eye with one of C3 PO's eyes.

 

Um, also lots of stuff for Stanley Kubrick. Um, uh, Steven was telling me that his dad built, uh. Spaceship from Space Odyssey, the model of it. Um, you just, I dunno, you just get this sense of history and passion and just a love of engineering. Beautiful old school British engineering and. As part of that conversation, we talked about so many things.

 

I cannot wait to get him on the podcast. I think you'll find him hopefully as fascinating as I did, at least those of you that enter a little bit of media, his history, a little bit of film history. Also, if you're into your record decks, the record deck that these guys make, the the Michelle M-I-C-H-E-L-L, I will put a link in the, in the show notes so you can go and have a look at the things they they made because they are stunningly beautiful.

 

And if I was in the market for that kind of high fire, I'd have one. There's nothing like it. You've seen it in a million films. Steve Jobs owned one. This is how good it is. And I've just been chatting to the guys who made it off the back of that. I ended up talking about ai, which I'm gonna come back to, but let me take the story of customer service forwards just a little bit.

 

So I've left there. We've talked about all sorts of things. We've talked about his love of Laua, for instance, where I work regularly and I'm forever telling people they are the exemplar of customer service. They are the epitome of it. They are the very best of the very best. And I've been lucky enough to work all over the world with all sorts of companies and all sorts of places.

 

Um, LA Manu is the benchmark for how, in my opinion, customer service can be and should be done. He agrees. We've talked at a length about it, um, and. What a, a wonderful conversation it was. So I left there really buoyant and I thought, do you know what I'll do? I'm gonna nip into Starbucks, which is just on the same complex where they're based.

 

Um, write some notes for the podcast 'cause I'm driving so I've got some broad notes written on the back of an envelope so that I gotta take my eyes off the road obviously. And I, um, went to get a coffee and here's where customer service broke down. I don't think the lady who's served me, lemme just get past that car I was trying to pull in.

 

I don't think the lady who served me could tell you now who I was. I don't think she really made eye contact. Um, the guy that actually made my coffee lovely. I mean, just served it. He made it with passion. It's got a love heart on the top. Um, maybe he's telling me something, I dunno. Uh, gave it me with a huge smile and told me to have a nice day.

 

She barely looked at me to take my money. Now I don't think that's her fault when I actually watched, 'cause I love watching customer service and figuring out why things work or they don't work. She had a Bluetooth headset on and at the same time she was serving on the till, she was taking orders from the drive through.

 

Now I defy anybody to do those two jobs at once and do them both effectively. Dear Starbucks, you've ruined it because you've cut your costs so low that the customer service bit the element, that is the only element that can set you apart.

 

Your coffee's not that great. Your cakes are not so great. And go somewhere else. There has to be about the atmospherics. It has to be about customer service, a smile or two, the way they deal with people. That's what makes any customer service based organization stand out because you can get coffee anywhere, you can get cake anywhere.

 

You can get a seat in most places. I want somewhere that was clean, had some atmosphere. As much as a Starbucks ever has atmosphere, I accept that. Um, and if I'm gonna pay, you know, what is it, six quid, I think it was my coffee, then I'd really quite like it delivered with a smile. And the guy, the barista did, but the customer service, the person on the tilt did it.

 

And I think it's because she was trying to do two jobs at once. And that's not something that you can do, I don't think to the best of your ability, um, when you've got one voice in your ear and another voice over the front of the counter. However, that's the end of my rant about customer service because I've had two of the three.

 

I've been standout. One single person company just cuts hair, but she's so much more than that. She always has a smile, always has something to chat about. After 18 years or 19 years or whatever it is, we still don't run outta conversation. We still laugh about life, kids, business, you name it. And then going to Michelle, Michel, Michel, I, I've gotta work out how to pronounce it 'cause it's Michelle without an e.

 

Um, Michel Engineering. And honestly, I have skipped outta there with the biggest smile. And then to be somewhat deflated. Why is that the right word? It's not deflated. Somewhat energized by some, fairly average at best customer service from Starbucks. It brings the other two into sharp relief, shows you what can be done, how good customer service can be.

 

And it's nothing more, in my opinion, at least in this country, about being friendly, taking time and making someone feel valued. And as photographers. That's a really important message, though. It's not what this podcast is really about. 

 

AI and the Future of Photography

 

This podcast was meant to be about and is about to be about ai artificial intelligence.

 

Yeah. I can hear a few of you blowing your cheeks out and do I need to worry about this or, oh God, it's just awful. All of these. Things. But let me kind of try and put it into context, and I'm gonna start with what I believe is going to be the headline for all of us as an industry. Now, I'm a portrait photographer, as are many of you not a landscaper.

 

I'm not a fine artist. I have my moments. I'm a portrait photographer. If I'm shooting weddings, I'm still a portrait photographer. I'm just shooting your wedding guest's fine art, as sorry as beautiful portraits. AI is coming now. AI in itself is not gonna take our jobs. However, another photographer who's using AI is going to take our job.

 

I don't think there's any doubt about that. AI's not gonna take your job. A photographer with AI is gonna take your job. Now, this week's been an interesting. Weak. I keep an eye on the headlines and I'll come to, to that in a little bit about how I'm thinking of creating some resources to help all of us.

 

But the headlines this week, there have been two that caught my eye, both within a couple of days of each other. The first, and one I hope you've all seen is that Vogue published an ad for guests who I, I Fashion house, I guess retail. Dunno. I actually, I, I, I don't know. I should know, but I don't. But they published an advert for Guess.

 

That was fully generated by ai. No model involved. It's a beautiful image, no question about it. And the model in it is beautiful. So beautiful in fact, that supermodels have come out and said her look is unattainable. It sets the standard that no one can achieve. Now I think there's a little bit of irony here, just a small amount, um, when supermodels are saying that, look, if someone is unachievable, something is awry.

 

Now this is a, obviously, I mean, that's a complaint that's been land lauded around the fashion industry for as long as I can remember. And in some weird way, maybe just maybe having unattainable synthetic models is maybe healthier than having unattainable. Actual human models because in the end you can always say, well, there's no way I could look like that.

 

In fact, there's no way that anyone could look like that 'cause it isn't real. So there's an interesting spin on it, I suspect. Guess the company obviously have had some really good publicity out of it, or at least they've had publicity outta it. Um, but of it highlights where we are headed. The little agency that created it, they're a five person team.

 

They charge anywhere between. Five and low six figures for creating one of these ads. So there's still money in it, but not money for photographers, money for models, money for location scouts. In fact, there's no money for anyone at all except for the agency, possibly the clothed designers. But I'm gonna guess that AI is eating into their world.

 

Two, that's not my world, but I'd be surprised if it wasn't given. It's eating into everything. The second article I read, which I, in some ways is slightly more alarming, is that Tata or Tarter huge, a huge multinational company in India. In their IT division, they're laying off 12,000 coders and middle managers 12.

 

Thousand 2% of their workforce because the focus is all on AI doing those jobs. 12,000. There are commentary and opinion pieces around talking about how that will rip out the heart of Mumba. Middle class wealth. That's how, that's how impactful this is. Real estate companies are saying that the market has dropped retail luxury items.

 

The middle class is being torn apart because those were middle class jobs for people who were smart, gone 12,000 jobs, 2%. And this is just the beginning. By the way. As fast as AI develops, people will find ways of either and or cutting costs and increasing productivity for the same or lower manpower.

 

That's where we're headed. Um, there doesn't appear to be any graduate jobs around at the moment, if I've read the headlines correctly, because companies, and this is the right strategy, by the way, are waiting to see quite what's gonna happen with ai. Would you take someone on who under employment law is difficult to get rid of if you are thinking well?

 

I wonder whether AI is gonna add productivity in a way that people might not. So AI is absolutely here and it's getting better. I think. GPT five, we've been talking about chat GT four, forever Chat. GPT five I think is due out in August. So we are right on top of that. If you're listening to this layer in the ear, it's already here.

 

And I can only imagine having used Chatt PT four extensively, how good five is going to be. So it's upon us and it's gonna be increasingly necessary if we wanna survive that. We don't just accept ai, we embrace it, we find out how to use it, we compete with it, not against it, 'cause you can't beat it. I've got no intention of going anywhere.

 

We are gonna use AI in any way and shape and form I can to do everything we do better. I don't have a focus on reducing my team. I love my team, I love being part of a team. But AI allows us to do some things and will increasingly allow us to do some things that either was specific to my time, that now can be distributed around the team, or allow me to do things faster so I can do more of it.

 

How many podcasts have I started by saying I'm snowed under? I'm so busy, I just don't have the time to do everything I need to do. AI is an enabler in that regard. So for instance, the other day I wrote an article for Professional Photo Magazine. I love writing. I really enjoy writing. There's value in writing.

 

I love, I loved more when professional photo was in print. But it's not anymore. Um, but I still write for it. It's online. You can read the latest article and we use ai and everyone's like, oh, you're using AI to generate your article. No, I'm not. I sat and wrote it like I always do because it was my story, my experience.

 

I was there. But what I did was I hopped onto chat, DBT, and in this instance I used O three, not. Chatt PT four oh, um oh three. They have different models and I'll talk a little bit about that in a minute. So I used O three and put in my finished article and said, can you help me subedit this?

 

So for those of you who worked in print and media, you'll know a subedit. The journalist will submit the article, it goes to the subeditor who'll do the final cut. And then it goes to the editor for once over, uh, maybe a review or two before it goes out into the publication. It's a subedit is a role subeditor.

 

So I said to, uh, chat GPT-3. Oh no, hang on oh three. Get it the right way round. Help me subedit. And it was brilliant. It helped me work out the threads of the jokes if they're, as much as they're jokes, so much as just light humor. Um, it helped me, uh, reduce repetition. It helped me get the tone of it about right for, um, a readership.

 

I explained to the readership was likely to be. It did all of those things. Um, and it just gave me ideas and said, maybe you want to just shorten this paragraph length in that one. You've mentioned this at the beginning. You might wanna close it out at the end. Those kinds of things. And then he said, and then he did a second review that said, that looks about perfect.

 

But you have said you love this. Three times, and maybe you wanna just turn that down a bit. Brilliant. It did something that would've taken me hours to do, just going over and over and over refining it because I don't have a subeditor. Um, I'm assuming professional photo. The website probably does, but whenever possible, I like what I deliver to be finished so that, um, it goes out and goes onto the website, their website as I intended it to, as much as that's possible.

 

And I love that it does things that make my life faster and more efficient and actually pro increase the quality that I can produce. Of course, the obvious stuff for photographers is on the retouching side. Voto, I've banged on about Voto forever. They're now increasingly more competitors to that. But in my opinion, Voto is still, EVOTO.AI is still the best.

 

Um, imagine ai, A-M-A-G-E n.ai is brilliant for coloring, for instance, it learns your colors and delivers 'em every time. Um, AI sharpening is really useful where you've got soft images, oh, the list goes on where we can now do things using AI that make my life, it makes it possible for me as a single camera.

 

I'm the only editor in the, in the studio, only post producer in our studio. So it allows me to do things to a standard I couldn't do without ai. Now, on top of that, we are starting to explore other avenues for ai agent ai. Which you can use to do things like, what did I see the other day? A brilliant article from someone with A DHD who uses ai.

 

And this is a very simplistic view of what they do, but this is quite clever for those of us who have a DHD tendencies. Um, you will know as I do that there are days when I can be super productive. I mean, do the work of 10, and then there'll be nine days where I do the work of none. It evens itself out, I grant you, but knowing your own mood and knowing what tasks suit that mood would be a really useful skill.

 

And so what this article said was how this guy had developed an agentic ai. So Agen AI is where you use AI to control ai. So it's a multi-layered ai. Approach and every morning one of many things he does, and this is just a small component of it, but I thought it was kind of cute, is he describes his mood.

 

And if you've listened to the podcast with Helen May, I think I did a few years ago, she talks about this. She talked about knowing what mood she was in, and she talked about knowing what mood she needed to be in. 'cause she talked about when she would take the drugs and when she wouldn't. And there were days when she had to be productive.

 

And days where it didn't matter. So if you can identify whether today's gonna be productive or not, you can. This guy had programmed the system to do this. 

 

AI as a Productivity Tool

 

He would tell the ai, I'm in a productive mood. I'm not in a productive mood. The AI agent would then go off. And talk to other AI agents about all the tasks that were in this guy's world that needed doing and deliver back tasks that suited the mood the guy was in.

 

So it's sort of like having a very intelligent team member alongside you, who knows your mood, knows what you've gotta do, figures out how to distribute that. This is just a tiny example of how AI can be super helpful, and I think that's how we have to view it. We have to view it as a tool for helping us do our job better.

 

A tool for helping us compete with other people who are using these tools. Now we're all gonna keep coming back to that theme because if they're using the tools, we need to use the tools. Now we are using all sorts of AI in the business now to do all sorts of tasks. 

 

Exploring AI Software: Xci

 

Incidentally, actually, while I'm at it, there's a great bit of software I found called Xci, E-X-C-I-R-E.

 

I've no idea if I've mentioned it before. It's worth a look. It's a bit like. ACDSee, which I love too. But it has an AI component in it where you can do a search saying, find me all the images similar to this one, but it uses AI to do it and it's pretty good, which is really useful when you are building, if you're doing, uh, a themed post on, let's say you're like, we are, I'm doing a thing on siblings, I can say, I can get a picture of two siblings and say, find me a load of pictures like this one, and it'll find all the pictures with two people in it.

 

They probably won't figure out that they're siblings, but at least you're halfway there. X-I-E-X-C-I-R-E. It's got a, there's a trial on a website. Um, it's not cheap, but it's a one off license. When see decided, I think it's about $250, something like that. So AI is very much here and now and it's not gonna be long before.

 

It's a whole different world. 

 

AI in Portrait Photography

 

So one of the ideas I have, and I'd love to hear. From you, if you think this would be useful, I think I'm gonna do it and just test it anyway, is I'm gonna set up a section on mastering portrait photography that just has short articles on ways to use ai. Little things we've found that techniques prompt engineering.

 

Um, we can talk about what we are doing, um, because I'm doing it, we're doing a load of stuff behind the scenes. If you thought it's going a little bit quiet on MPP, just for a moment. That's why, because I'm trying to figure out how to really harness the tools that are here today and the tools that are coming tomorrow.

 

Now, of course, you know, I accept, I do accept, as a slight caveat, my PhD is in ai, so there is a fascination with what's going on in this sector that many of you probably or possibly don't have. And I, I do accept that. Of course, I accept that. My, my, my fascination with where the tools and techniques that we were part of decades of developing are now here.

 

And, and this is, you know, by the way, this is why I say that it, you know, we have a toddler, I've said this a lot, we have a toddler of an AI world right now, and it's growing up is because 30 years ago we were saying the same thing. Then, you know, imagine what the scientists are gonna do in 10 years, 20 years, 30 years.

 

Imagine that now what scientists are gonna do in the next 10 or 20 or 30 years. So yes, I accept, I have an enthusiasm and an excitement about AI that maybe you don't share. But equally, there's lots of little things you can do, like product engineering, like setting up memories if you use chat, GPT, like setting up product knowledge.

 

If you use Claude, like understanding how things like Gemini. Vo flow. These create more creative tools from Google, possibly can help you in your everyday work. These are all so useful and so right here, a, a, a great example. 

 

Using AI for Workshop Transcripts

 

Now, when I run a workshop or a one-to-one or I do mentoring is I'm aware of this same microphone that I'm recording now.

 

One of the roads, whatever they're called, uh, something or others. Um, I just record it and record all the audio of my voice when I'm running a workshop. That's all it needs. Just what did we talk about from my point of view? Ideally everyone would have microphones on, but it gets really quite complicated really quite quickly.

 

So for now, it's just me with a mic. I take that audio. Let's say there's 10 hours of audio from a day. I take that audio and I put it into Da Vinci. Why Da Vinci? Because actually the AI tools won't deal with a very long audio file yet. They're just not there yet, but. And I could put it into Descrip, which I use for the podcast, but you pay quite a lot of money for a 30 hour per month transcript.

 

And taking 10 hours of that just to do each workshop. And I do a couple of workshops a month is not ideal. It goes into DaVinci, which has a subtitle generator. So it takes an hour to go through 10 hours of foot of video, of audio, sorry. And it creates a transcript, subtitles, I take the subtitles and I put those into usually chat, TP, T oh three or four oh, and I can then interrogate the transcript and do different things.

 

So, great example, uh, chat, DPT. I enter something like, uh, this is a workshop I ran with five delegates and me, the voice you will read is mine. These are my words.

 

Teaching a subject title to them. Whatever the workshop is. Let's say it's mastering studio lighting, I dunno. So these are all the things I talked about in response to questions or self deduced. I want you to give me useful information that. I can send back to the delegates that are the key bullet points and details that they might find useful.

 

And then at the end of that prompt, I put the following, ask me whatever you need to be 95% certain of delivering this task to the best of your ability, or something along those lines. It will then ask me a series of questions. It'll say things like, what was the purpose of the workshop? What did you think delegates have done?

 

Again, out of it, were there any questions that delegates asked to you before the workshop that are not answered here, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. You answer those and then it will feed you useful information. It will obviously, and here's a really interesting difference. I love chat. GT 4.0, all four one.

 

They're great. It will say things, if you put this into chat GPT 4.0, it will say, oh, Paul, oh Paul. That was not just a workshop. You did not just educate them, you inspired them. You are incredible. Oh, I love your work. Here's some ideas. Oh my God, they're gonna find so useful. Here's ba blah, ba ba, and they give you a load of things to send back.

 

And it will say at the end. And if you ask it, if you're very smart, what you actually do is you also ask it, how could I improve the workshop? And it will say, I don't think there's much you could change, but here's some ideas. And these might just help you deliver more, uh, I dunno, more, more clarity or more information or help the help certain types of, uh, delegate understand more.

 

It's really useful as a coach for me too. If you do the same exercise with O three, which is a reasoning engine, it works slightly differently. It's not just about language. It's now reasoning. It might say, well, you did these points, here's some useful information. Here's some ways you could do it better.

 

It's like having a very blunt, best friend with no filter. It's a lot more useful in so many ways. But nowhere near as much fun as camp GPT. Oh, Paul, you're amazing. I love it. I'd dread them taking that side away. Uh, Claude is even, by the way, if you use c Claude ai, it's even more, I sometimes wonder whether it's, it's in the name Claude.

 

It, it feels like it might be quite rude. It just tells you, these are the things you didn't do very well. You should do this better. Okay. 

 

AI Tools for Photographers

 

Anyway, point being, we're using AI to gather more value outta what we're already doing. We're not trying to make things. Um, streamline things or make things, uh, it's not a race to the bottom.

 

If anything, it's a race to the top. So we're using AI throughout. Uh, so I'm gonna set up a section of MPP that's all about ai, little tips and tricks, information I'm reading about engines, AI engines, et gentech ai. Things like zapier make.com, if this, then that where they've now got AI baked into them. So you can do clever things if you have, you know, just a spreadsheet, for instance, you can tell, um, things like make.com without ai.

 

If you are good at code, you can tell it what you want it to do in terms of maybe posting stuff. Um, if you are good at coding, that's great. If you're not good at coding, you can use AI to help you with the coding. It's not brilliant, but it's not bad. And you can get prototypes up and on their feet really quite rapidly.

 

You can get it to give you layouts of websites, just ideas. You can get it to design logos, just ideas. Now, yes or right, if you make your living on five or designing logos, maybe that's not a great thing to do. But actually when you boil it down as photographers, how many of us actually use Fiverr more than once or twice?

 

I've used it a couple of times in the entire time, and frankly, I've been disappointed. Might be strong a word, but certainly not thrilled with what I got back. Whereas with ai, yeah, all right. I might not be thrilled with the first one or the second one or the third one, but eventually I'll get there by tuning the prompt and getting it to refine what it's doing.

 

Um, I dunno if anyone else has done this. You say please and thank you. Um, I do, and then I feel guilty if I need to correct it, but you do need to correct it. And I'll, I'll publish some articles on these, all these little bits on a section of MPP to try and make it, uh, to try and it's, it is now so much a part of a portrait photographer's life.

 

That not having a section on it feels kind of weird. Um, and so look out for that in the coming weeks as I figure out quite how to, uh, get that information on there, uh, quickly enough and without it distracting from the things I'm already finding difficult to find time for. So that was my little thing of ai.

 

And if there's a footnote here, of course, it's, uh, from Michelle this morning, the record deck, my turntable, um, Steven and I were chatting and we got chatting a little bit about ai and he said, oh my God, we use it a lot. And introduced me to James, who is. His son-in-law, I think he said, and I had the opportunity.

 

We went back in, actually, we'd been sit, stood on the doorstep for an hour chatting. I went back in at Stevens behest to go and talk to James. Actually, it was to show me C3 PO's eye and then go talk to James. So I went to talk to James about how they're using ai and I won't. I, I, I, he never said there's anything confidential about it, but I'm gonna treat that with confidentiality.

 

But it was really intriguing what they're doing with ai because some of what they're doing, I didn't know. It was possible. So I'm gonna take that information now and have a look at how you can use things in a way that I was unaware was yet possible. It feels like certain areas are already possible ahead of what I was aware of.

 

Um, well, that's it. Let me retract that. That's stupid. Of course, there's a ton of stuff that's possible that I'm unaware of. Um, I meant more mainstream, just simple stuff. Just ideas of how to use things. Absolutely brilliant. And that's where we are. AI is not gonna take your job, but another photographer using it.

 

Well, that's a whole different discussion. Uh, I hope this recording's working all right. I hope it's not too noisy. Um, I'm now stuck in a 20 mile an hour queue behind a lorry because they've, uh, resurfaced the road. So there's a, uh, grip kind of, you know, a grip warnings everywhere for stuff flying up. So we're all traveling nice and slowly.

 

Skid risk gets in. I'm not gonna ski anywhere. Um, so what else do I just want to mention? Uh, right. 

 

Mentoring and Workshops

 

We have workshops running. Uh, we learned our lesson by the way, uh, everybody said that. Uh, yes. Workshops on a Friday. Great. So we asked you workshops on a Friday. Great. Um, and then we put workshops on a Friday.

 

Much harder. Thank you for that one. Uh, all of our workshops are moving back to Mondays, which in the end when we spoke to everybody yeah, everyone said, everyone who said, yeah, Fridays are fine. When we went back to Mondays he says, oh great, it's back to Mondays. That's much better. So Mondays, the workshops are back on Mondays as a whole series.

 

I can't remember 'cause I'm driving what they are. Uh, but please do head over to mastering portrait photography.com and find the section on workshops and, uh, they're all listed. We'd love to see you. Uh, we are doing a lot of one-on-one mentoring now, which is lovely. Some of my favorite things. To do is to actually spend time sitting and well, I mean, I have to hope we impart some knowledge, but there are days when I think I'm just enjoying spending time with photographers, um, and discussing, uh, their work.

 

So if you fancy that details, give us an email, drop us an email and find out what we offer because we do, uh, what else was, I'll just finish judging. Uh, or I've got one. I've done my first cut of judging. So the way I like to judge is to do everything. And by the way, the deadline is Wednesday, Thursday. Um, and you might think it's a little bit last minute.

 

It's last minute because my monitor blew up. Um, I've had this Ben Q monitor for years, a decade, and it decided to pack up. Um, my eye mark. The colors I've known for a while, the colors are wandering and no amount of, um, calibrating. And I always calibrate. No amount of calibrating is gonna fix that because it's got magenta areas turning up.

 

On the corners, the middle's all right, but the rest is awful. So there's not a lot I can do about that. So I had to buy, I had to shell out for a new Ben Q 4K photographer's monitor. It is stunning. Oh my God, it is so nice. It's all calibrated Spider Pro. Um, it turns out that Ben Q's own calibration software does an unbelievable job of calibrating itself with a, with a spider pro that I've got.

 

Um, so the colors that are absolutely gorgeous, they look well, I say gorgeous, they're accurate, which actually is not necessarily the same. Thing. Um, but of course you can't judge a competition until your monitor's calibrated. So I spent many hours yesterday judging now the monitor's in and on. Uh, it's such a privilege to do what I do.

 

Um, mentoring, judging, coaching, you name it. You know, when I started this business or I started out as a photographer two years ago, I never, well, and I nearly said I never dreamt. I did dream of doing the things I now do, and here I am doing it. And it's no less of a dream now that I'm doing it, uh, than it was back then when I imagined doing it.

 

It's brilliant. It's one of my favorite things to do. Uh, so yeah, I was judging. Week. I can't remember how I got into this. I, I've lost. Oh, mentoring. I'm talking about mentoring and coaching. What a privilege and a pleasure. So if you fancy bit of that, uh, we do offer it now. Uh, one of the reasons I stood down after three years of being the chair of judging in awards for the BIPP was to give me a little bit of bandwidth and the political space to do more coaching and mentoring because you obviously, it's difficult to mentor if you are the chair of the association that now assesses the people you are mentoring.

 

That's a little bit of a conflict of interest. So I never did any mentoring, uh, while I was chair with, see I do now. Uh, what else? 

 

Mastering Portrait Photography Book

 

Oh yeah, his news. Most of you may have heard this 'cause we've had various social posts out about it. The book, mastering portrait Photography, the book, which is where it all kind of started 10 years ago.

 

10 years it's been out, it has sold 50,000 copies. It has been translated from English into American English. Do you know what? There's a complaint on Amazon. One of the very first reviews, it gave it four stars. They knocked a star off because we used American spellings. I mean, you do have to ask yourself, I'm sorry.

 

It was never published in British English. It went straight to American English because do you know it's a bigger market? I'm sure the publisher knew exactly what they were doing. Um, and so they only published it in American English, so apologies to the British English fanatics. It's in American English this time as well.

 

So it's been translated from American English into, uh, Italian twice. There's a normal copy and what's called a kiosk copy. They were both done by National Geographic. It's been translated into German. It's been translated into Chinese, and it's been translated into Korean. Now. Those last two we knew nothing about.

 

It's only when we were doing the audit a couple of weeks ago that Sarah drilled into it. And found them. We actually have a picture of the Chinese copy 'cause we have some Chinese clients who very kindly sent us some pictures, um, from, uh, Hong Kong. Uh, if I, if anybody's listening to this from Korea, I don't know if there is, but if any of my clients have Korean contacts or Korean family, or are Korean, is there any chance you could send us a picture of a book cover of our book cover Mastering Portrait Photography by Paul Wilkinson and Sarah Platon in Korean.

 

Um, that would be super valuable. Uh, at some point I try and get a copy of it, but even our publisher doesn't have copies. It must have been done locally under license, but it's out there. 50,000 copies translated into four languages and a decade later we were asked to produce an updated edition. Um, you will know this 'cause I've talked about doing the process.

 

It is done. I have one copy sitting in the studio, one copy of mastering portrait photography, the updated edition, and I have changed every single picture except one. There's one picture in there that's exactly the same as it was 10 years ago. Uh, we may yet run a little competition to see if you can spot it.

 

It will be on sale or it's already on sale. Pre-ordering. It will be on sale I think on the 14th of September. The original date was the 9th of September, but it's been pushed back a little bit by the publisher to allow distribution. We should get copies in the studio. We'll order a couple of hundred to be able to do signed copies and get them out to anybody.

 

Um, we're holding a launch event, um, for anybody who's in the book. Anybody involved in the book sometime in, uh, October. We will let, we'll give you details about that once we've got them finalized. Um, right. Hang on a minute. I'm gonna take a back road 'cause this road's been really noisy, so I'm gonna go cut through the back roads, which are quieter.

 

Uh, and, um, it's, it's out and about for pre-orders. Yeah, I do apologize again if this, if this podcast is a little bit noisy, I do apologize. But like I said, it's a podcast on the Land Rover, uh, right. Roundabouts. Hang on, let me just concentrate on traffic. It was good. Okay. Um, however, I want to just, I will try and get this podcast, Eric, today, which is Tuesday, the 29th of July, 2025.

 

Um, why? Well, because Waterstones in the UK have an offer on the book. They have an offer 25% off pre-orders. It's being promoted by Waterstones. Um, I'll put the link in the show notes, but if you Google mastering portrait photography, summer offer Waterstones, you'll find it, um, if you pre-order it, uh, before the 31st of July.

 

The offer only started yesterday. Um. Then you get 25% off the, on the offer. I promised the publisher we would promote it. So that's, um, out in September and I am beyond excited about it. Um, I talk about this quite a lot and, and I think we'll update mastering portrait photography with the stories behind some of these images.

 

But every one of the images is in some form a client, a friend, someone we met, someone who stood in to do a photo shoot, you know, people like Barbara and say Hi, working on Crystal Cruz's, just the most amazing people who stepped in to allow me to demonstrate certain techniques. Our normal clients, our son Jake, and our daughter Harriet, who are both in there with their permission.

 

But broadly speaking, it's our clients. It's the people who we photographed along the way. There's so many in there. I can tell you a story about every single image, every single moment, every single client, and on the back cover. So the front cover is Dory, who we met. She was serving US food in a really lovely Thai restaurant in the Crazy Bear.

 

And I asked her, I met her and with, I mean I was with Sarah and um, we were chatting and I said to Sarah, I think she'd photograph really well. And Sarah bless her because you don't have to do this when there's just a couple of you having a nice romantic meal and you start talking about whether someone would photograph well, there's every opportunity, uh, for that to go wrong.

 

But Sarah is the most incredible human being, and she too realized that Dory would photograph well. And so I asked her, I said, with Sarah said, go and ask us. I asked her and I said, would you be photographed? Would you be willing to come and be photographed? I think you'd photographed beautifully. And she said, no.

 

She looked at me, shook her head, said No. Walked away. Now, luckily we weren't on the final course, so she had to come back and I wrote on a paper napkin. I wrote, uh, my web address, my email and said, look, go and have a look. Um, I dunno why I thought, I have no idea. I just assumed, I dunno, I'd call it arrogance.

 

I thought, well, if you see my pictures, you'll want to be photographed by me, people in a rare moment of super confidence. Um, so anyway, I gave her that and she walked. And last night I thought, we'll never hear from her. At four o'clock that morning, the next following morning, there was an email came in that said, yes, please, I've looked at your website.

 

I would love to have my photograph taken. And that has started a friendship that goes on today. Uh, Dory is still this most incredible person to photograph. She is lovely. She is funny. Um, she is, well photogenic, doesn't really begin to describe it. She has the most beautiful daughter, the most incredible husband.

 

Um, she now has done some modeling off the back of it, and it's her picture from that from.  First session that we filmed actually for mastering portrait photography. We filmed it specifically to go with the website to support some of the ideas in the first edition of the book way back. And it's her face on the cover. One of our first, one of the first times I approached someone to model, and on the back cover is Jess.

 

Now, I first met Jess a few years ago, age 12, and she came to the tame food for. Where we had a, you know, popup stand selling vouchers and our wares, and she approached us and said, how much would it be to do some portraits, some photographs of me doing contortion, contortion, contortion being a contortionist, and she's 12 years old.

 

And what am I gonna say to a 12-year-old who is gutsy and asking about being photographed? She was there with her mom. You know, this is no. Our conversation that I would have with a 12-year-old obviously. So I had the conversation with her and our mom and I said, well, look, one of the things we do a lot of is we create videos and we run workshops and mentoring.

 

And I'm always looking for people that we can point in front of the camera who are interesting, have ideas, um, we can create really beautiful pictures off the back of, um, so why don't I trade you some time? So if you come. To the studio and I'll do some pictures for you as a client as long as you come back as a model and let us just take whatever pictures my delegates need and we're always looking out for models like this.

 

Um, and she said, yes, she agreed. I said that way, I don't need to charge you, but I get something in return that is really valuable to me too. So she came for the first contortionist. Photo shoot. She's a gymnast and a contortionist and a dancer. And um, over the years we've continued to work with her. She has now got a modeling contract.

 

We now help her with that too. I was writing my instincts that she would photograph well. Um, more importantly, she came to a workshop, I think. I'm sitting in the Lounge Rover. If I sit in my microphones in the studio, I'll tell you exactly the title of the workshop. I think it was Advanced Studio Lighting, or it might have been a avail, it might have been mixed.

 

I, I think it was Advanced Studio Lighting. And towards the end of the workshop, a couple of the photographers, we'd done a lot of freezing movement. Hang on, let me just let this guy out. We've done a lot of freezing movement. 'cause of course, you know, one of rom's brilliant features. Um, is that you can read on the back of the lights.

 

The pulse width, so that how the duration of the photo of the light pulse on the strobes. And so if you're freezing motion, as long as your pulse width is, is you know, ideally three thousandths of a second, but a couple of thousandths of a second or faster, you'll on the whole freeze motion. So we'd done that all day and a couple of the guys said, can we do something capturing movement?

 

Now, if you. Saw the work I did at the Society's convention this year. You'll see this kind of technique in action, and what we did is we lit her with two light sources. We lit her with LED, quite a lot of LED actually, and slowed the shutter down so that we could capture that movement in light. And then we fired a fast pulse at her face and her hands to freeze that bit.

 

And then we practiced some, uh. Um, sort of dance moves really of her flinging a dress around a ball gown and caught a couple of images that do both. They both strobe, they both freeze her hand, capture her movement, and when you get that stuff right, there's something really magical about it and we got it right.

 

At least I say you get it right, if that's, did I get it perfectly? No, of course there are things I'd change. There's always some. Thing you'd change? No, no image is perfect. But I think we did pretty well and I would happily do it all over again. Well, that picture's on the back cover, and we didn't know this.

 

We knew about the front cover because we'd sent over probably 50 or 60 full face portraits for the designers of the book to pick, and they pick Dory, which fills my heart with joy and on the back cover unknown to us 'cause we never saw it in advance. They've put Jess, who you know, was a 12-year-old gymnast and contortionist who had the guts to ask how much would it be to come and have a photo shoot.

 

And so I'm thrilled for both of those people, both clients that, you know, for the next 10 years we'll be talking about the book with them on the front and them on the back. Uh, it's out there, it's on Amazon, or you can wait. Until we get our copies and we'll send out signed and mounted copies. Um, sorry, signed and signed copies not signed and mounted.

 

You get into a rhythm with these things don't you? Signed and mounted prints obviously, but signed copies of the book. Um, we'll put that onto, uh, our website in the coming weeks once we know when we are getting our stock of them. Uh, apparently the print run is now done. It's now all about warehousing and distribution, logging, all of those kinds of things.

 

So that's coming out in September. Waterstone's, just a reminder, they have a 25% offer right now that if you pre-order it, uh, on their website, you get 25, uh, percent off. And I'm selling it for full price, which is 20 quid. Alright. Just so you know, uh, I'm gonna sign it. Um, send it out. But it will, um, it will be the full price.

 

Uh. Uh, no discounts. You can get it from, if you want it cheap, go to Amazon If you want it signed, come to me. Oh man. I've brought us round a back route. Oh, that pub's open again. Wow, that's good. That pub closed. It's reopened. Um, and on that happy note, as Irun my way back through bucking shirt, Buckingham, she's back lanes.

 

I was laughing with someone the other day, just how beautiful this bit of the world is. You forget because it's familiar. You forget it's your doorstep. You. I've traveled across the world to go to places that don't look that dissimilar to where I live and sat in admiration of these locations when it, you know, sometimes it's not a bad idea to sit and admire my own back door.

 

It's absolutely beautiful out here. Um, though the roads are in need of a little bit of repair.

 

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

 

So on that happy note, please do head over to mastering portrait photography.com, uh, which has, as ever, tons of articles and is the spiritual home of this podcast. If you've enjoyed the podcast, uh, please do subscribe wherever it is that you get your podcast. It's on iTunes, it's on Spotify, it's on YouTube, uh, wherever it is.

 

Please do subscribe if you have any questions. Uh, who knows? Maybe you do. Uh, please do email Paul at paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk co uk. Uh, people do email in now. I think. Uh, I'm trying to remember the name. I saw the email come in. I think it's John. I think John, thank you for your email, John, uh, who wanted to know about the type of paint we use in the studio.

 

'cause I've spent ages trying to get it right. Got it. Right. This. Time, uh, got it right on two counts. I can't remember what it is. By the way, if you wait, if you're hanging on waiting to find out what it is, um, I can't remember what it is. Uh, Sarah emailed, uh, this morning the answer. I've got a top of it sitting in the studio.

 

Uh, a white paint for the wall that is broadly speaking, the same white as a white calibration chart. It's also super tough and super white clean, which is great for any of the posing boxes we have because we've forever putting coffee on them and leaving coffee stay. Well now it cleans off. It doesn't stain the paint.

 

It's absolutely brilliant. Uh, the point of the story is somebody emailed in and asked me if you have any questions, please do so. Uh, so until next time, whatever you're up to, wherever you are, and I hope. The view as you drive along is just as stunning as this is. I've turned the corner. It's just wheat field after  📍 wheat field and hedges and hills.

 

It's like a postcard. Oh my goodness. It's lovely. I hope like me, you're enjoying where you live and until next time, whatever else, be kind to yourself. Take care.

Join me in the foothills of the Dolomites for a warm, funny, and surprisingly philosophical conversation with Mauricio Arias — Graphistudio’s strategist, storyteller, and, as I’ve dubbed him, their “Product Philosopher.” We dig deep into why printed work still matters in a digital world, how to make your images sing in print (and what that print will brutally reveal), and what photographers need to believe if they want clients to invest in heirlooms, not hard drives. There’s laughter, there’s wine (not during the recording, I promise), and there’s a lot of heart. This one’s for anyone who’s ever asked: does my work really need to exist on paper? (Spoiler: yes. Yes it does.)

Links:
Graphistudio: graphistudio.com
Mauricio Arias: mauricioarias.art

 

What Graphistudio Can Teach Us About Craft, Confidence, And Creating Heirlooms

Featuring Mauricio Arias – from Episode 165 of the Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast

This summer, I found myself at the foot of the Dolomites, tucked inside a sun-drenched meeting room at Graphistudio HQ, chatting with the wonderfully philosophical Mauricio Arias. He’s part strategist, part designer, part storyteller—now officially dubbed (by me) the Product Philosopher of Graphistudio.

We’ve used Graphistudio products for over 15 years. Our clients love their albums and wall art. We love their consistency, their craftsmanship, and their beautifully obsessive attention to detail. So when Mauricio and I sat down for a conversation, I had one question in mind:

Why does print still matter in a digital world?

Mauricio’s answer was simple and heartfelt: because photographs are meant to be held. He spoke about growing up with albums on the coffee table and family portraits on the wall—how physical images root our memories in something real.

But what stuck with me most was this: "Printing reveals both the beauty and the flaws." A great print will elevate your best work, but it also exposes any cracks in your post-production. It’s humbling. And it’s powerful motivation to keep improving.

We talked about calibration (yes, you need it), about photography as an emotional craft, and about the importance of believing in what you offer. Because if you don’t believe your work belongs in an album or on a wall, how will your clients ever believe it?

We also touched on the future—on AI, on trust, and on the rising value of human, handmade, tangible things. Heirloom prints are becoming more important, not less.

🎧 Listen to the Full Conversation

Listen to this episode to hear the full interview with Mauricio Arias. There’s laughter, insight, and plenty of inspiration—especially if you’re in the business of turning moments into memories.

📬 Want More Like This?

Subscribe to Mastering Portrait Photography for access to videos, articles, and behind-the-scenes tips to grow your photography business. Whether you're just starting or refining your craft, there's something for everyone.

Explore Membership

Written by Paul Wilkinson · Photographer, Educator, and Portrait Philosopher-in-Chief

In this episode, I dig into a question that’s always lurking in the back of a portrait photographer’s mind – what really makes light flattering? It’s a term we all use, but what does it actually mean? Is it just about soft shadows and low contrast, or is it more about the connection between the subject and the photographer?

I talk through this while reflecting on a busy week – from a stunning wedding at Head Saw House to a corporate shoot for Barclays, and a spontaneous portrait session that reminded me why I love this job. I also share some thoughts on the updated Mastering Portrait Photography book, which hits shelves in September, complete with fresh images and a whole new chapter on AI post-production.

If you’ve ever wondered what makes a light truly flattering – and why it’s about more than just the gear – this episode is for you.

And as always, wherever you are and whatever you’re doing, be kind to yourself.

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

 ​

 Well, as I sit here in the studio, the sun is shining in through the windows and it's been a beautiful, beautiful week. I started it with a trip down to Devon with the in-laws. One great thing about being married to Sarah, whose family are from Plymouth, there are many great things about being married to Sarah.

But one of the ones, in terms of geography, at least, is her family still lived down in Plymouth, in Devon, by the sea. So it was absolutely glorious to spend a couple of days down there walking the dog, drinking a beer, enjoying the sunshine, and the sun is still shining here right now. And on that happy note, I'm Paul.

I'm very much looking forward to a barbecue, and this is the Mastering Portrait  📍 Photography podcast.

  📍  📍 So what did we do over the past week or so since I recorded the last episode? Well, Sarah and I went off and photographed the most beautiful wedding at a location called Hedger House, which is sort of in between us and London, give or take a bit. Um, and you'll have seen many, many Hollywood films, uh, that were shot there.

None of which I can remember. There's a couple of James Bond films, a couple of Dustin h Dustin Hoffman films. I don't know, I should have paid more attention, but it is the kind of venue that you can imagine. Downton Abbey, uh, being filmed in. As it turned out, it was Abby and Rob's wedding. Um, beautiful.

I've worked with the family for many years, photographed her brother's wedding, uh, a couple of years ago, and so we've been looking forward to this day enormously. And when Sarah and I work together, it is a great privilege. It's not just that Sarah, uh, Sarah's family are from the sea, but she's a fantastic photographer.

Um, not that we've ever really used that talent, but if you think about it, it makes sense given that she must see. Well, I dunno how many hundreds of thousands of images every single year go past her screen. 'cause she does all the selections, but also she knows exactly, exactly what's required to design a great album.

Because at the end of the day, I. It's Sarah designs them. So it was a real beautiful thing to be able to do. Sarah has created some wonderful imagery. We've also had a couple of portrait shoots, three or four this week, which I've really enjoyed today actually. We've had one came in for a reveal and one came in for a shoot.

Two lovely families, and at the end of the day, that is still what this business is about. There is so much going on out there in the news about ai, about technology, about the economy. But in the end, the bit of the industry that I sit in, this bit here is all about families. It's about memories, it's about real people doing real things.

So it's been absolutely brilliant to be. Uh, photographing families, uh, and also selling, uh, a beautiful frame. This morning. It was absolutely lovely, big layup of multiple images, uh, to go on the wall. Uh, also this week, um, I took a trip into London to photograph the Barclays bank. A GM set up quite specifically the setup.

The brief actually said, do not include people where it's possible. So that's fine. I was there to photograph, um, for the, um. The production company that do all of the work behind the scenes. They create all the staging, they create all of the film work. My job was quite literally, quite literally, to be there and make sure that was really well documented, which I did.

But of course, because it was such an early start, I had my, um, original call in time at the venue in the security on this. As you can imagine, this is Barclay's, the A GM. Um, I've never seen security like it, and I've actually photographed this event probably 10 years or so now. I never seen security quite like this one.

And with a seven o'clock start, I had to, uh, stay over in a hotel the night before, which was great. I mean, it's no problem. There's plenty of hotels in London, but it did mean I got to go out for the evening with Harriet, our daughter. So the two of us met up the night before, um, had pizza, margaritas, a beer, a glass of wine or two and more or less.

Gassed just gossiped, um, all the way through until it was time for both of us to part our ways, me to go to the hotel and for her to head home. And there was really something really special about getting to spend time with your kids as a dad. It is the greatest pleasure. As you watch your kids grow up, you watch their confidence increase, you just, well, I do anyway.

Absolutely love spending time, uh, with both of 'em. So that was really, really nice. Then of course, the next day, um, I went and photographed all of the bits and pieces for the A GM. And then at the end of that took the opportunity to go and meet a prospective client that we are planning a shoot for a big client.

Um, and they want to create over two days, sort of 50 unique portraits of different people with different backgrounds, but all looking like their shot in their place of work. But they're coming from all over the uk so we're gonna do it in one location, a mix of the street, a mix of different offices, almost like, um, filming really, it's a bit like putting together, um, a film or a documentary where you use different backgrounds to tell different stories.

So I met up with a client, um, a marketer and a graphic designer, and it was. It was actually quite a laugh because I didn't think I was only really there to help them shape the job, help them figure out how we're going to do it. But of course, I had all my cameras with me from the job I was doing in the morning, and so I dragged one out, dragged a lens out, um, and we sort of barreled around the building, taking portraits of them, um, having a look at how the different backgrounds might work, discussing lots of little details, you know, the things that people miss when you're working on location.

You can't, for instance, assume that you're going to be able to use strobes because much of this building is an open plan, and us firing strobes while we're doing portraiture probably isn't gonna work because it's distracting for everybody. Now, if we're in a closed room, that's fine, but if we're out in an open plan or in the atrium, or in the restaurant, or in the library.

I'm gonna guess that's gonna be majorly distracting. So things like allowing for the fact that we are probably gonna be using continuous lighting, probably gonna be using LEDs, which is fine. There's no problem with that. But that has other knock-on effects because it's slightly different equipment and it will work when the light levels are reasonably low.

But you can't overcome things like direct sunlight or you can balance to a degree, but it gets very bright very quickly. And we are not a film studio. I'm not gonna go and set huge great shadow boxes and things over the windows. I'm not gonna have a tunnel lighting. I'm gonna have a very simple portrait photographers lighting set up.

But it was a huge amount of fun, and the pictures have actually come out pretty well. I'm quite pleased with them. Even though we were working off brief, we were just sketching. But of course, as a portrait photographer, that's your job. And when you do this at weddings, people expect that of you. But when you're working on the commercial side, I think it surprised everyone that it was well, that easy.

I don't mean I'm not playing this industry down, but taking a portrait is mostly about understanding how light works and then understanding how to read. And manipulate characters, how to be a people person with great light. Actually, that could be the topic of a podcast. All and of its all, all in and of itself is, you know, portrait photography is understanding light.

I. And how to manipulate people. And once you're there, there's not an awful lot left, uh, to do. So that was, that was a real blast. Um, I'm looking forward to doing the actual gig. We sort of got our heads around the scope of it now and that couple of hours we spent really did illustrate the best way to plan the shoot book people in, and generally approach him.

Uh, also this week we spent a day, uh, Sarah, Katie, myself and, uh, Abby, one of our regular models. Um, the video we're recording for the mastering portrait photography website. This time round is going to be all about those lighting patterns that have names, the eight or so. Um, lighting patterns, uh, single light lighting patterns.

Lighting patterns with one light, maybe that sounds better, where, um, they're sort of lighting patterns for me. I, I didn't really understand or didn't know, rather, the lighting, the names of lighting patterns until I started to teach. And still, in fact, we wrote the original mastering portrait photography book because although I knew them.

I didn't even know they had names. I'm not in that regard, a formal photographer, but it's really useful to know them because you can jump straight to that starting point. It's a little bit like learning your scales on the piano or maybe learning your rudiments as a drummer. To me, certainly. I mean, I've done both of those things and to me they were the est, most boring, mundane things that you had to do, but you had to do them as a piano player.

You had to get your fingers to have muscle memory so that if you needed to move around certain notes, you could get there. You needed to know in certain keys what notes went together. Similarly, as a drummer, you had to get your wrists loose and your fingers loose. And be able to move around the drum kit fluently, fluidly, and fluently, and the only way of doing that is repe repetitive practice.

It's repetition, doing it over and over and over again. Much as I didn't enjoy it, it paid dividends when I found myself on stage or in a recording studio. Then all of those hours spent at a practice pad or. As a piano player learning my scales suddenly came to fruition. And just for clarity here, I was an awful piano player.

I hated the scales and I had very little talent. I, I could play a bit, I could play enough to, you know, Russell Une, if I really thought about it, um, was not a great piano player. However, as a photographer, the value in learning these named lighting patterns isn't about the names and the lighting patterns themselves.

It's learning why they're called what they are and how to do them and be able to recall them if you need to, and certainly when, for instance, as a mentor and as a trainer. It's so much easier if we can talk about lighting patterns by name. You know, I can, we can talk about this shot would've been better lit short or lit narrow.

I think this face shape might have looked better lit. Broad maybe. Um, you know, Rembrandt lighting is very theatrical actually. Rembrandt light is one of those really obscure lighting patterns that everybody knows about. Every photographer, loves and can name and can create the triangle on the cheek. But that's usually done with a hard light source.

But if you really want to use it, you've gotta use a soft light source. But knowing where the light goes so that you can create that beautiful, gentle roll off across the top of a cheekbone is a practice thing. So anyway, we spent the day. Recording all of these different lighting patterns, and they're gonna look really beautiful.

I mean, Abby's a beautiful model. Um, we shot it really clean, so every picture you'll be able to see precisely what we're talking about. So we shot each one with a hard light so you can see exactly where the light lands, where it falls, and then we shot them with a soft light. So you can see how might, how you might use exactly the same positioning of the light to create great portraits.

So I'm looking forward to finishing that video up, which we'll do, uh, I'm gonna guess Wednesday next week. Um, and that will go out onto MPP. That'll be this month's, uh, video. Uh, a lot of fun. Um, today, uh, like I said, a reveal. All the cookies have gone. The kids needed chocolate. Um, so I'm sitting in the studio thinking like, quite fancy a cookie and nope, they're all gone.

Um, but the sun has been beautiful and so what a lovely, a lovely thing to do. Uh, some big news. Now, this has actually been rumbling on since, uh, January, I think. Um, but it's now, um, out of embargo is that we've, Sarah Platon and myself have been asked to revise the mastering portrait photography book. Um, the reason the website is called Mastering Portrait Photography is 'cause we produce the book.

The publisher have asked us to rework it. And so I've actually just spent a few months, um, reworking every single portrait. Except for the one of me, you can't really see that it's me. I dunno when it was shot. I look like, um, I've been dragged through a hedge backwards, and I've left it well alone because it makes me laugh.

So there's still a shot of me holding a camera in there that hasn't been revised. But every other portrait in there has been, they're my clients. Every single one of the people in that book is a client of ours, or it's from a job where we're doing a workshop or a masterclass or something. I can tell you a story about every single picture, and it's been such a pleasure.

It's 10 years old this year. The book, it came out around about, I think it came out in May. Well, I could look the dates up in, um. 2015 and it's gonna come out is, I think the launch date is the 9th of September this year, 10 years. 10 years ago we first created it, but we've reworked all of it bit by bit by bit, picture by picture, by picture, um, so that it's still the same book.

Um, it's definitely a second revision. We haven't changed all of the wording. We've revised some of it. And the post-production chapter, I've reworked to be mostly about. As it happens, ai, so the mix of Lightroom, Photoshop, and then uh, tools like Voto. I should, again, for clarity. Uh, I'm not sponsored by any of these companies.

These are tools and apps that I pay for. I wish I didn't. If, if a Voto are listening, feel free to b me a sponsorship. But no, I pay for it. Um, I pay for it because it's useful, makes my life easier. Um, it polishes images at a rate that I could not have kept up with. Photoshop, not. In this market. Now, if you are a high-end fashion house doing fashion photography, maybe you could beauty shots on the covers of magazines.

Yeah, maybe you could. But to, we can produce, you know, to a level of about 18, maybe even 90% of that level of detail. And you can do it in a heartbeat. So things like a Voto, the last chapter in the book, the post-production, uh, chapter, has been completely rewritten to include. How we now use things like ai because if this book, let's say this book has another 10 years on a shelf before it needs revising or taking off ai, I think would've completely changed.

Not just this industry, but every industry and the most valuable things will no longer be how good you are with a computer or how good you are as a coder, or even how good you are as a writer. All of that will become. Commoditized. You can simply tell a machine how to do it. The value will be, I think, in your intellectual capacity to imagine things.

Now, I know you can go into Mid Journey and type a bunch of keywords in, or you know, Firefly or Dali or whatever, but in a very real sense. That's not art or creativity, it's just the computer spitting stuff back at you. And the same is true when you're doing creative writing, but if you truly have interesting and original ideas and configure out how to articulate those, AI is gonna be sitting alongside you every step of the way.

And what's left? What's left when. Those kinds of tools become just the heartbeat of your work. Whatever's left is the personal contact. It's the people to people, the human to human, the character to character, the very physicality of being in the same room as someone, hence the. Why I get so excited about doing portrait shoots.

I've done that all my life, and I still feel that way, that when I'm face to face with a client, yeah. All right. I mean, I know I'm an idiot and I am loud and I laugh a lot and you know, every time I have a a, an adrenaline rush, when I'm working with a client or I meet new people afterwards, I will forever beat myself up for being.

I guess embarrassing, but that's the joy of being human. Um, the tooling, the behind the scenes stuff, the management, even social media. You don't have to go onto social media for very long before you start to see AI generated videos, AI generated images. Um, and the truth of it is, I'm not sure I can tell the difference anymore, but the, the days of six fingers to three hands funny necks, they're gone.

These, the AI tools that are appearing now are super realistic. Um, and if you can do that with words, imagine what you can do with a photograph as your reference point. So anyway, the book will be out. Sorry, I've digressed slightly. The book will be out on the 9th of September. It's called Mastering Portrait Photography.

Um. Um, it's already available for pre-order on Amazon, which means I can now, um, share details of it. We've been under embargo up until this point, but, um, the rework has been done. Now looking forward to, um. Seeing the actual printed, but I've got some proofs sitting here beside me that arrived this morning.

Uh, that, uh, I just wanted to confirm some of the colors were are spot on because one of the great things I think about Amini to produce this book is their color work. That printed work is just beautiful. The prints look like competition prints in the book. It's a proper, it's, I mean, for us it's a training book.

It's a kind of a walkthrough. Things you should think about as a portrait photographer, but actually. As the photographer. It's a coffee table book of some of my favorite work, so that'll be out 9th of September. You can google mastering portrait photography. The book is available on Amazon, and of course we'll announce details of, uh, signed copies.

Uh, we're gonna have some kind of launch bash, I'm sure of it. Uh, I cannot, absolutely cannot wait. Uh, and then onto, I think what I intended to talk about today, which is linked to the lighting patterns I talked about. But it is simply this question, what makes flattering light? And I see titles of videos, how to use flattering light, how to use this light, how to use that light, and nobody really explains.

What do you mean by flattering? You know, Rembrandt pioneered. Well, did he pioneer? That's, no, he didn't. He put his name to an observed lighting pattern that created a triangle of light on his cheek. Um, is that flattering? Well, it created a very effective, very gloomy portrait, the way he painted it Anyway.

Is it flattering? I dunno. I mean, certainly it looks great. What about soft light? The thing about soft light is we all always talk about soft, flattering light. I mean, if you ever hear the word flattering light, you're probably, it's probably prefixed by the word soft. And what do we mean by soft? Well, usually soft.

We talk about soft edged shadows. That's normally what we're talking about. But of course, contrast ratios are supremely important, too soft. Edged shadows and low contrast tend to give forgiving light. They tend to reduce wrinkles or they reduce the amount of modeling that might be across a part of someone's figure or face, um, that makes it harder to discern.

Lumps, bumps, textures, hard light, hard edged shadows tend to reveal. I tend to reveal light. That's a shape more than soft light. But what if you want to, for instance, reduce the perception of somebody's width? Is soft, light, soft edge shadows, low contrast, light better, or is it better to have. Very contrasty.

Light, dark, dark shadows where everything disappears into the gloom and hard edge shadows where when it's wrapping around a curve around a body, for instance, the lip part is gonna be slightly narrower than if you lit it with a soft edged light. Well, no one can answer that. No one can tell you which is the most flattering, only the subject and the creator can tell you the people actually there in the room.

The interaction between the subject. And the creator, you the photographer. So when we talk about flattering light, what really do we mean? And I think what we mean and what we have to agree to mean is flattering light is the light that creates a picture that you love and a picture that your client loves.

If that's hard light, if it's contrasty light, if it's soft edge shadow light, if it's low contrast light, it doesn't really matter. Your ability to read your subject, your ability to read, shape and form and textures, and how to either exaggerate that or reduce that. Well, that to me is what creating flattering light is all about.

Anyway, uh, that was not, which I, I dunno why I thought that would be a topic to talk about, uh, today. And the last thing, um, I'm just, before I sign off, I've, I'm just, so I'm gazing round our studio as the sun is going down. I have to do a big tidy up tomorrow. That's my job tomorrow, is to absolutely sort this studio out so it's nice and tidy for our very first, uh, inaugural two day bootcamp, which is Monday and Tuesday next week.

Now, you may be listening to this podcast after that's been done, um, but I will give you an update. Next week as to how it has gone. So it's two days, a maximum of 10 people. Um, a mix of being here at the studio out on location round our amazing village. Um, we've also rented, um, a hall in a local church, which will give us a ton of room to really play and explore lighting.

Our studio here is incredible. I love it. It creates the pictures that I love and pictures that clearly our clients love. But putting 10 people plus me plus models into it is just. I'm gonna be a little bit tight if I want to move the lighting around. So we're gonna have, uh, spend some time over at local church hall, which is always funny, um, because it's very real for most people who don't own a studio.

Being able to show how to rig and use studio lighting in any space you are in and all the considerations that go with it. For instance, we've been around there and, um, the, um, lots of the pin boards around the room have bright colors because they use it as a crash. Well, bright colors get bounced back. So you're gonna get yellows and pinks coming back off your light.

So learning how to work with that and how to reduce the colors of light. You don't want an increase of color, of light you do want. Those are gonna be part of the topics. We've got two days in the evening between the two nights, uh, pizza, lots of chatter about portraits. Um, and then on the Tuesday, a wrap up.

Uh, more photography and in the afternoon looking at, uh, technology, looking at, uh, Photoshop, Voto, imagine all of these tools that you can do things with. So I'm really, really, really excited about it. And that's, tomorrow's job is to go through the studio. You can see it, if you can see the edges of my desk, I'm kind of glancing around.

It's, there's so much stuff here. Uh, I collect stuff. I can't help it. Sarah keeps trying to get me to either sell it or throw it. Um, and at some point, of course. I will, but in the meantime, in the meantime, if you fancy coming on one of our workshops, please do head over to mastering portrait photography.com and go to the academy section.

All of our workshops are listed there. A bit too late, obviously for the bootcamp. Uh, that is Monday, Tuesday this week and it's sold out. Uh, but coming up, uh, our various workshops throughout the summer ranging from our on location in Oxford Workshop, which might be, and we haven't done the two day, uh, two day bootcamp yet.

This might turn out to be my favorite, but working in Oxford for the day, just taking pictures on the street using whatever light we can find. And our client, oh, sorry, our models this time. Uh, one of our wedding clients, the beautiful people who I photographed at the Manir, the most unassuming and gorgeous couple.

So I think that's my favorite. That's, uh, on our website. I don't, I think there's a space left. And then of course, there's a whole load of other workshops and opportunities for if you would like to come for some mentoring, like to come for training. Um. One-to-one, whatever it is. If we can help, we will. So if you fancy any of that, head over to mastering portrait photography.com and uh, go to the academy section.

And on that happy note, I'm gonna go brave some hay fever. 'cause it's the evening the sun is set. I feel there might be a barbecue in the offing. My nose is ever so slightly bonged up with hay fever. In spite, in spite of the drugs. So I'm gonna head away. Uh, hope all is well with all of you and whatever else on this beautiful, sunny Saturday evening, be kind to yourself.

Take care.

Well, it's the day after The Socieities Of Photographers Convention in London.  What a blast! 

Judging, laughing, making friends, presenting workshops, representing Elinchrom Lighting and Evoto Ai, learning, exploring, creating and very little sleeping! The Convention is quite something to be a part of!

In this episode, I try and explain what it feels like to be a small part of it whether judging the print competition, presenting or mixing with the trade - the various stages I pretty much always go through from fear to elation and everything in between.

Enjoy!

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

Introduction and Post-Convention Exhaustion

So late last night, we returned from the societies of photographers convention in London, and you can hear him. My voice. I'm exhausted. The convention is such an incredible thing. 3 4, 5 days. Of mixing with the trade running workshops, attending workshops. And one of the most important print competitions in the industry, and that is anywhere. In the world, it's been a blast. You can hear just how tired I am.

But in this episode I thought I'd battled through the fatigue and talk to what it's like to be a judge, a presenter, and a delegate. At this incredible convention firsthand. I'm Paul, and this is a slightly weary. Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast.

Well, hello, one and all. I hope you're all. Well, it's been a busy store to January.

If I'm honest. Uh, we were hectic all the way up to the convention. And even today, the day after it's all over, I've just been photographing a family.

Roles and Responsibilities at the Convention

Uh, this year at the convention, um, I was a print judge, a presenter, and an ambassador for Elinchrom Lighting. Uh, the company that I just adore using their products.

And so to everybody who I've met, everybody, I've talked to everybody who I've laughed with, shared a drink with shared an idea with. Maybe argued over print score with thank you. Thank you for making the Convention such a pleasure. However, as I was sitting on the train coming home, it struck me. That there are definitely stages stages to how you feel. When, at least in the role I have. Uh, your attending. The convention.

The Nine Stages of Convention Experience

Um, sort of like the five stages of grief, I suppose these are the nine stages that I go through each and every time I attend the convention.

It's the thought processes, it's the things that make me tick. Uh, it's how I feel. It's how I feel before is how I feel through it, doing it in this, how I feel afterwards. So let me step through them. Um, as usually when I come to the end of a judging process, I'll talk to all of the things I heard during the judging and give tips on producing. Uh, competition level prints, but I've done that so many times, this year, I just thought I go through the emotions, the various stages. Did I feel every time. Um, I attend the convention.

Stage 1: Excitement

So let's start with the obvious stage one. Excitement.

This kicks in the minute that, uh, the convention confirm. That you're going to be attending. They confirm that you're going to be running some talks. They confirm that you're going to be a judge.

Um, there's a real kick, a real thrill when that comes in. And then you start to think about what you'll do you start to, you've already had to put some ideas in, so those are going to be the titles of the talks, but you start to really plan out what that might look like, and that's six months out. We will start to put in, um, our applications for the 2026 convention in the next few months.

So you have big ideas. You clear the diary. Of course, you make sure that those dates are available. And at that stage, there is nothing more than excitement. Obviously a little bit of pressure to get some social media out and tell the world you're going, but it's all about the excitement. And then you roll up closer and closer and closer to the day.

And you're sitting on the train, heading into London, stage two.

Stage 2: Nerves

Nerves.

I don't know if everybody goes through this. But I do. I start to worry that I've got all of the kit. I need that. I've got enough of a plan of what the workshops and presentations are going to be. I start to worry about that moment you walk into a room full of people that for some reason, in my mind, I assume I'm not going to know.

Of course it's never like that, but that's how it feels. Um, also there's a really important to this year. It was a three o'clock deadline, you have to be in the judges room by three o'clock. Don't turn up. You're not judging and that's an Intuit. You have to be at the judges. Briefing. Meeting. And Terry Jones from the societies, she will talk through all of us as judges as to what she's expecting, how are we going to be. Uh, scheduled, what the runtimes are, what sort of language it's, uh, just an update and refresh on a language we're going to use how it's going to work.

And if we're not in that room, You're not judging. And of course, the bit where I get the most nervous is as I walk in now I'm an extrovert. I love being in a crowd of people, but I've always had this fear of walking into a crowded room and not knowing anyone and having to sit in a corner. Uh, sort of minding my own business, finding people to talk to not being certain of myself.

Now, luckily for me these days, I've been in the industry for so long that I know probably two thirds of the people in the room. Um, so it's not as bad as it used to be, but I used to be terrified and I'm still nervous. I'm still trepidatious. I'm still uncertain of myself. Um, but I walked in this year and of course it was just brilliant.

And that brings me on to, I think, Uh, stage number three.

Stage 3: Sense of Belonging

A sense of belonging,

a sense of being part of the family. There were so many hellos and handshakes and hugs and laughter and faces. I recognize some, I don't. I was introduced to new people. There's just this wonderful sense of coming back home.

I love the convention for that. Of all the things that it brings, I think to all photographers. There's a sense of being part of something bigger. I think there are about 50, maybe 60 judges in the room, plus the print and handlers and all of the teams around us. And it is the most incredible feeling of belonging and for the next sort of 12 hours or so, um, after the briefing, there'll be socializing some food, um, maybe have a drink with a few people.

It's a real sense of family. But then we come on to stage four.

Stage 4: Pressure of Judging

We're walking in to begin the process of judging the next morning. So this is the premier print competition in the world. So stage four is pressure.

And even though I've been doing this a long time, I've been a judge. I can't remember how many years it is now. Probably 15 years. Um, there's still this sense. Of responsibility. Because each and every print, we will see hundreds of prints. But every single print is unique to the author.

Every author has put everything they have into it. And trust me, you do not enter a print unless you think it stands a chance of winning? You might not say that to people you might say, oh, I don't know. I just thought he might try my arm, but you haven't entered a print. You haven't paid for it to be printed mounted and then the entry fees. For you not to think it stands a chance of winning.

And as a judge, you really do feel that sort of pressure. You feel the responsibility as you sit there, the print comes up and you have to go through all of the elements, the 10 elements that were giving us, given us judges. Um, Um, on which to base our assessment and ultimately a score.

And there are five judges on every panel. And these are some of the best. Photographers in the world. So if you put in a score and it comes on the screen, And you're wildly different to the other judges. Of course you feel that moment? Have I got that wrong? And there's a process for this as the challenge process. Um, and each of us know how to do it.

Each of us have our own particular way of doing it. Uh, I had to run a few challenges this year. Um, and you're looking at the scores and there was one in particular where it was quite a long way out of line with the other judges, my school was higher and I'd seen things in that image that at least based on my assessment of it, my experience warranted a higher score. And every judge by the way has had exactly this happened to them.

This is not just me. But I'm sitting there looking at the scores and I'm thinking. How hard have I got to work to try and get the other judges to see what I see, to feel what I feel, to evaluate the image in a similar way to me, or at least come closer to where I am. And these are photographers that some of them I've never met before.

Some of whom I have met before everyone has their own style and their own way, but you then have to talk to the image and talk to the other judges. And see if you can convince them. That possibly there are things in the image that this time round, they may have missed that you, um, have seen. It goes the other way as well, by the way.

So if somebody else puts in a score and minds lower. The same process will happen. But now it's me trying to listen, trying to understand where maybe I've missed some key factors in an image and that's particularly important when images come up, that aren't in your wheelhouse things that you don't specialize in when it comes to portraiture and weddings, or maybe photographing dogs. I of course know what I'm looking at.

I understand that process really well. That doesn't mean I will always have seen everything, but it does mean that probably I'm in the right ballpark, but sometimes you get an image that challenges you tries, you tests you, it forces you to think in a different way. And while I might understand the print process, I'll understand the creation process, I'll understand the presentation, there may be things about that moment or about that imagery or about that style of photography that I might have missed. And so I'm eagerly listening to the other judges to see if it's something where I've just mostly get my score a little bit out and I need to be. Um, come a little bit closer to the overall score that's been, uh, the first round score that's been calculated or maybe just maybe I'll hold my ground and say no. I hear you. I understand what you're saying completely, I just feel for these reasons I've got my score about, right.

So can you imagine the pressure when you raise a challenge or you're involved in a challenge with really well-known photographers from all corners of the world, um, the pressure is immense. It really is at that moment, the most important job in the world. And on top of that, we've got a live audience.

So it's not even just that you're having to do. Um, or having to think on your feet and figure out your scoring, but you also then have to articulate that in a way that is clear. It's polite. It's respectful to the print, new author and the rest of your judges, but it's also educational, interesting entertaining, maybe because to hold an audience in the room, as judges we have, not just the responsibility. Of creating the right scores or appropriate scores for the images and bear in mind. Bear in mind, if you have a different judge on a different day, the chances are you going to get a slightly different score?

So don't think that these are absolute objective. We feel all the time, the pressure of that. But during that process, we are also for the people in the room, entertainment. With air to be interesting, as well as educational we're there to help them understand, but also for them not to be asleep. In the room, the rooms are pretty dark because of course we've got the prince lit at the front. Um, We have a microphone, but our backs are to the audience.

And somehow we have to be not only knowledgeable and skilled and respectful, but also to a degree entertaining. There's a lot of pressure on it. And it's not just the pressure of judging the prints because of course. Um, for me and most of the judges. I was also running two workshops or two masterclasses, and doing presentations on the Ellen Crum lighting stage.

So during the rest of the convention, even once the judging is done. I'm still feeling a huge amount of pressure to be the very best I can be to represent Elinchrom and the brand, to the best of my ability. And again, that's part education, but mostly entertainment. If you're stood on the stage, creating pictures, it's not really about the technicals, that techniques, that care moonlighting modifies.

It's really about being interesting and entertaining and giving people things. To go home and try themselves. And the workshops are almost exactly the same, just on a much longer format. So you really do feel the pressure to make sure everything's working, and when the audience are in there, that you give the very, very best of yourself.

Even yesterday, I had what we euphamistically called the graveyard shift, which is the last set of presentations, not just of the day, but of the whole convention. The trade show by now is closed. There's nowhere else for delegates to go, except home. And nearly everybody you speak to is like, right.

It shows done. I'm going to go catch my train. So you rock up to a room and I had, for the final session, I had the biggest workshop room. There is, um, I don't know how many people it can hold. But I was expecting two or three people to stay behind, maybe. Uh, we've got the last, uh, workshop I ran. This year was on high-key and low-key, uh, studio lighting, um, and going through the process of how you think about these things, how you evaluate. Um, the person in front of you, how you react to them, how you decide what you're going to shoot and how you then go through the stages of shooting it. I'd put together. A pretty good idea. And I assumed I'd be presenting it to two or three people who are going to brave the last trains home and stick around, even though there's a gap after the trade show, closing and the workshop starting.

Well, the room was packed. It was an absolute thrill to be there. And the last few. Minutes or hour the hour and a half of the day, with a full room and incredible model. Uh, Eloise Hare was our model and playing with these beautiful Elinchrom lights and just showing different ideas and not just with a full room, but it's a room full of people who really interactive, really engaged.

And so thankfully all that pressure I'd felt throughout the five days. Uh, dissipated in the last workshop.

Stage 5: Elation

And of course at the end of that, you get to stage five, which is elation.

And that for me, at least a sort of celebration, um, uh, almost a euphoria. Um, I've been meeting people and I'm an extrovert, so being around people really recharges me. I've been talking sharp. I've been talking photography. I've been talking lighting. I've been catching up with people's businesses. And we've been creating images and I've just been feeling like I'm at home. These are my people. Every minute of every day, it's just a sense of recharging.

It's a sense of, um, joy and conversation. It has been absolutely brilliant. And that's that sense of elation and you close everything down. You finished your last presentation, you put everything into its bags and then you get to stage six, which for me.

Stage 6: Regret and Insecurity

Is sort of, I've called it regret. It's a sort of insecurity, a paranoia.

That's always been with me. I've never got rid of it, which is where I panic about all the things I've said that possibly I shouldn't have. The people I wished I'd had a chance to say hello to, but I only waived. Waved over a room. Um, You know, there are always people at the convention. I just would, I went there thinking I'm definitely going to see them.

And the closest I got was to wave at them across a bar maybe. And I regret not having had enough time to see everybody, but that isn't enough time to see everything or everybody. I regret that maybe. I didn't give the best to me. I've given everything I can every single moment, but there's still that slight insecurity that maybe I didn't quite get to everyone. And maybe of course my scores of the images were off.

Now, of course, when you're judging. You have a panel of five people, um, and that's there deliberately. That's there. To stop it, any outliers, really railroading and the show. And that's really, really good. It means that even if I'm one image, I scored it. S off slightly too high, a slightly too low. Maybe there are four other judges to make sure that that doesn't really matter, but you still worry about it.

You worry about whether when, um, the chair of judges is looking at you. Uh, whether the person who created the images, looking at you, or whether the people that run the competition are looking at you, they're thinking. Oh, Wilkinson's a bit off this year. Isn't it? You worry. And that's always part of this. Sort of coming down from the, all of the energy and the adrenaline. Um, and then the fatigue and the grief regret, start to really kick in.

And that leads us on to state seven.

Stage 7: Fatigue

The fatigue, the utter tiredness.

And you can hear that. in my voice. I can hear that in my voice and it kind of speaks for itself. Um, I got home, I think at about 10 o'clock last night, I was in bed by 11 I was asleep by five past. And Sarah myself. Woke up at about 11 o'clock this morning. I don't remember being quite so tired. I was so tired.

I am still so tired. And of course today I've had a family in the studio and I've had to go back to giving a hundred percent and all that meant is now I'm even more tired. The fatigue is part of it.

And yet that's not the whole story because there's also now beginning to, to kick in a sense of stage eight, which is opportunity.

Stage 8: Opportunity

I've made new friends, some incredible friends. Um, Chris and mark in particular. Uh, really made me laugh.

If they're listening, they'll know exactly who they are. Two monumental photographers from Australia, monumental creators, monumental. Um, intellects and I've loved sitting on the panel with them and listening and learning from them. It's refreshed existing friendships. It's refreshed all old friendships. Um, we've had new ideas, new thoughts. Um, new challenges, new things to think about new ideas for creativity.

And of course, being a judge, I get a double pronged chance at that. I get to not only mix with the most knowledgeable and in pressive photographers in the world, but also to see images, competition images up close and personal from some of the greatest. Um, talent's there to the people that have entered in. Not necessarily people I never get to meet by get to see their images. And that in itself gives you new ideas and new things to test you.

Today, in my family shoot, one of the four people, it turned out through chatting with them that they heavily into steam punk. I did not know this what a brilliant idea. And she's quite keen to come and do some photography she's into cosplay, um, and steam punk. And she would like me to create some pictures for her too.

But that really is it a development of some of the images I've seen over the past four days.

And that leads me on to what I think is the final stage.

Stage 9: Energy and Optimism

And that's a sense of energy.

Now for me. I'm an extrovert. So being in this huge crowd energizes me on its own, but being in the judging, seeing these images, seeing these photographers, talking to the other, the other judges, um, just being in that space. Is energizing for me.

And there's enough energy out of the convention. Every January to last me a good six months it'll fade. Of course it'll fade. This is a tough industry, right? We all know that. 2024, I think was brutal. Um, I don't know if anybody feels the same way as me, but that's how it felt. We hit our numbers just about, um, our revenue figures, but of course, Our costs have gone up. And so we really had to battle. To, um, get the numbers in and get our clients in.

Um, 2024 is a year that I think on the whole I'm. I'm not glad it's gone. You should never, ever be glad that at the passing of time, but let's just say that 2025. Is a whole new year brand new, fresh. Um, full of opportunity, full of optimism. And the energy that I get out of the convention, having met all these incredible people will drive me for a good six months.

And that's really important. Uh, Sarah and I are about to spend. Seven weeks working for cruise company. Uh, around south America. So at the end of this month, um, we leave half the team running here. And myself and Sarah will go and, uh, travel abroad. Um, and so I need the energy. I need the optimism.

I'm going to need the drive because even though that is the opportunity of a lifetime to spend seven weeks traveling, including five days, uh, attending and working at the, um, Working on the cruise ship while it's docked at the Rio de Janeiro. Carnival is, um, just the opportunity of our lifetime. Um, but I'm going to need every bit of energy I can find because we've had to clear the diary for those seven weeks or at least reduce the amount of work in it and had to do an awful lot of work in the run up to it.

And I'll have to do an awful lot of work. Um, when we come back from it and particularly on the customer side, but also a Mastering Portrait Photography, still creating the videos and the articles. But that stage nine, is that sense? Of energy. And then before I know it, it'll be back to the sense of excitement when we're trying to, um, get our talks and our workshops booked in for next year, 2026.

Conclusion and Gratitude

So to everybody who I've met, everybody who I've talked with, everybody who I've laughed with, it has been the most incredible five days.

The first two, I was on my own. And then Sarah thankfully joined me, um, for the, the, the end of it. As no fun. Sarah being though, when we're judging, we are literally down in the basement, um, judging for from nine o'clock. I did the one day we'd judged from nine o'clock, till seven o'clock in the evening, nine in the morning to seven in the evening. Um, it was the thrill of a lifetime, not just to be judging the rounds. Um, but this year I was one of the judges I'm looking after the final, final selection, um, which is such an honor.

But it was no fun for Sarah, if she was. L on our own. Um, and so she joined me for the last, uh, few days. Um, thank you to everybody that made it such a joy, made it such a thrill. Thank you to the Societies. And of course, in particular, To Terry Jones and her team on the competition side. But everybody on the trade show, everyone at Elinchrom. Everybody who I met every delegate, every single delegate, those of you that came and were quiet.

And didn't say word those of you who came constantly ask questions. Um, all of it. Just made me laugh too. The two models I worked with. Um, to Marissa and Eloise. Thank you for just being beautiful, not just photogenic, but beautiful as souls. Um, thank you to every single one of you. And on that happy note, it's a Sunday night.

Apparently I've got some cottage pie waiting for me back at home. So I'm going to round this. round this. podcast off, and wish you all well for the coming year. And I hope. I hope. you're as energized as I am for the coming 12 months. Take it easy and whatever else be kind to yourself. Take care.

So after three days of judging images for the British Institute Of Professional Photographers, it's time for me to step down from my role as Chair Of Awards And Qualifications.  I have been in the role for three years and it is time for someone else to pick up the reins and run with it (if that isn't a mixed metaphor.)

I have loved doing this and if it weren't for a million things I have to go on and do, I think I would do it forever!  So as I drive home from my last round of qualifications - possibly the best one I've ever been involved in - here are a few musings of things I have spotted.

This is a 'Tales From The Land Rover' edition so please forgive the audio quality and any mild road rage!

Enjoy!

 

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

EP158 Heading Home From The Awards

Introduction and Event Recap

[00:00:00] Paul In The Defender: So for those of you who love the Land Rover episodes, you'll be thrilled to hear that I'm just leaving the BIPP, the British Institute of Professional Photography Awards, uh, event 2024 25. Uh, why do we call it 2024 and 2025 is because if you get an award at the end of a year, it's a real pain from a marketing point of view if you can only say you have an award for 2024. So we call it 2024 slash 25, uh, just to extend the marketing value. So you're, you hold the titles for a year, , so why wouldn't we? Anyway, that's where I've been. I've just spent an absolute fortune on some fuel, uh, because I hadn't got a lot of choice but to fill up at a service station.

[00:00:47] And I am just pulling in to traffic. He says, concentrating on driving.

Driving and Multitasking

[00:00:52] Paul In The Defender: I had a lovely, uh, lovely email from someone this week. , sorry I'm driving so I can't, uh, look up your name. I'm so, I think it was John McCarthy. I'm gonna go with John McCarthy. , who said, amongst many other things, uh, he doesn't know how I drive and record a podcast at the same time.

[00:01:09] Well, the answer to that is I drive. And chat. Uh, there's not a lot of structure to it, , and a few people have said this week they like the podcast like that, uh, because, uh, they find it interesting to hear me ad libbing. I don't know whether that's, I don't know whether there's merit in that, but yeah, I am ad libbing because driving is the priority.

[00:01:30] They also said, uh, John said, I'm sure it's John McCarthy. I hope it is, if not, uh, I'm crediting somebody who's a fictional character. , he also said that uh, he can hear in everything we're talking about just how busy we are here at the studio. And it must be hard to find the time to fit in to do the podcast, and it is, which is why, uh, I am recording while driving.

[00:01:52] , but he did also go on to say, he loves it when we do them. Uh, they are really valuable. They don't just disappear out there into the ether. There are lots of you out there in the photographic community listening to, uh, hopefully enjoying, uh, at least to a, a greater or lesser degree, the podcast.

[00:02:10] So here we are. I'm Paul, and this is the Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast. Well, hello one and all. Uh, I am in relatively. Reasonably slow, fast ish, medium paced traffic, which is not good for me getting home quickly. I've got about an hour and a half of driving, but it is good from a road noise point of view 'cause at this speed, the road noise in my Land Rover isn't quite as, uh, intrusive as it would be. I see. It's not so much the road noise as the wind noise in this thing. I'm just looking at the other side of the motorway and thinking, I'm glad I'm not going that way 'cause it's must have been an accident.

[00:03:01] It's absolutely log jammed.

Reflections on a Photography Career

[00:03:04] Paul In The Defender: Uh, so what have I been up to? Well, it was the awards. It was the British Institute of Professional Photography International Awards yesterday in, uh, Bromsgrove, which is in Birmingham, in the Midlands, in the heart, in the heart of the country. Uh, an absolutely wonderful event.

[00:03:20] Lots of our friends and lots of colleagues, lots of photographers, uh, having a drink, having a laugh, and celebrating some of the very best images. That you can, uh, possibly imagine is absolutely brilliant. Uh, I have to say it's my last formal event as chair, uh, of qualifications and awards of the BIPP and I.

[00:03:41] I guess I have to just say a quick thank you, uh, to Martin Bains and the guys at the British Institute for asking me to take on the role. It has been the honor of a lifetime. You know, when you start out in photography, I, I was just a kid with a camera. Actually, to be fair, I still probably am, uh, just a kid with a camera.

[00:04:02] I've just grown quite a lot older and now earn my living from it. But the enthusiasm and the awe and wonder of what you can do with this gadget hasn't diminished at all in the time since I first picked one up at age, sort of, seven or eight or whatever age I was when my grandfather's, uh, Kodak Brownie.

[00:04:21] So to be. Chair of Quals And Awards for the oldest photographic association in the world has truly been the honor of a lifetime and when Martin asked me if I'd take that on three years ago, I think I might have been a bit reticent because I wasn't quite sure whether I could deliver what he needed, but hopefully we've gone on to answer the question.

[00:04:42] That was an emphatic yes and he, he and the board let me create a program and methods and standards That I think we can be really proud of. , and at the end of the, uh, sorry, at the beginning of the awards yesterday, so it's the end of my tenure. It's my last one as chair. So it is a, it is a sort of a bittersweet moment for me 'cause I've loved it.

[00:05:01] Uh, I'm only stepping down because I desperately need to find time to do a load of other things. And now is the time after three years, all the work we've done, uh, you know, on the, on the judging side for me, but particularly on Sarah. Putting in processes and making sure you can get judges when you need them.

[00:05:18] , so I'm gonna say thank you to Martin, thank you to the B-I-P-P-A huge thank you to Sarah. And thank you to all the judges who've judged with me, , who've been part of the team. , hopefully over the coming years I'll be able to stand back on the other side of the line and judge alongside the judges that for the past few years I've been sitting in front of while chairing.

Honorary Fellowship Award

[00:05:38] Paul In The Defender: , the other thing that happened last night, , so forgive me, this is a very personal. It's one of those things where I don't know quite how to do it, but I'm so chuffed I'm going to tell you anyway. I was awarded an Honorary Fellowship of the BIPP. So, if you're not in the industry, I guess it's hard to articulate just how rare these things are and what an honor they are.

[00:06:04] There's only 26 or 27 Honorary Fellows in the industry. And as of now, I am also one. I already had my Fellowship. I got that in 2011. , Uh, but I now have an Honorary Fellowship, which is, it's been given to me. It's engraved on the thing is for services to the BIPP, which I rather like it. Uh, so it's just a real privilege to be given that, , I never, you know, just being chair of quals was to be honest, gratitude enough but it is still a lovely thing to be presented with. And that will carry with me for the rest of my life, you know. You keep that title, , and I'm so proud. I was so surprised and pleased last night and so proud now.

[00:06:50] But I must also just put out there that, although it is me because I'm the photographer, it's my letters. , actually, this particular one has to be 50 percent Sarah. It's Sarah that coordinated the judges. It's Sarah that managed things and runs me. It's Sarah that manages my time. It's Sarah, and even last night, several of the judges were telling me they were sad to see me step down, but actually, , it's Sarah they're really gonna miss.

[00:07:16] So, uh, this goes to Sarah more than anybody else. Uh, so that's a huge, huge thank you. Right, traffic's all braking. Good job I've left lots of gaps, that's nice. Right, so, what was today's topic?

Key Ingredient for Great Portraits

[00:07:31] Paul In The Defender: Today's topic is, , based on a question that a client asked me the other day. So I was photographing a beautiful family, mother, father, nine month old baby,

[00:07:42] The weather? Horribly unkind. It was cold and raining. Your perfect blend of the two types of weather that you don't really want to photograph a baby in. However, we did some studio work and the little girl possibly got a little warm and a little bit grouchy, and so we stepped outside just to see if we could get anything and it turned out, actually, just going out into the cool air, uh, sort of, she, completely cheered up so i think she might just have been a little bit warm or she just didn't like being in the environment of the studio i don't know which but out in the cool air so her mom's holding a huge umbrella over her she sat on one of my our doormats from the studio and scattered the front edge edge with leaves so it looks like the little girl is sitting in this beautiful sort of array of leaves but she's actually sitting on a dry mat in the middle of our lawn and beautiful light and of course when you have water around and Those sort of gloomy bluish tones from a cloudy sky actually the colors pop, you get these oranges and greens that are really interesting.

[00:08:45] So we got these incredible pictures and, and afterwards we're sitting chatting and it was the, it was my client, it was the dad said, so what is it? He said, what is it that makes, what's the, the one thing you have to have to make a great portrait? Ah, well, you know, you don't ask someone like me to talk about stuff like that, or at least you don't if you want a short answer.

[00:09:05] Uh, so of course the obvious answer, , I'm a lighting specialist. , I love portraiture, but I've always been fascinated by light, its qualities, its colour, the, the shadows that it creates, and I think light obviously is a key ingredient, and I think if you were being Purely pragmatic, you'd have to say the one thing you need to create a great photograph is light.

[00:09:31] There has to be light because without it, it's dark, and if it's dark, you've not got a picture. So, that's a really pragmatic answer, but it's a bit dull and a bit obvious. And as I'm a portrait photographer, and during that day, I was taking his baby's portrait, and I've taken their portraits before now. It got me on to think, what is it?

[00:09:48] What is that primal? Thing that absolutely makes a portrait. And I think it's a relationship. That is my answer. , it's the relationship you form. Oh man, we're in a rolling roadblock. , that's what's going on. , so there's a slow moving, uh, police car or two.

[00:10:06] At the front of, , this particular traffic jam, so we're now travelling at 10 miles an hour. Uh, if we, if we carry on travelling at 10 miles an hour, I'm assuming we won't, but if we do, uh, I'll still be travelling home tomorrow. It's going to take us a while. I'm going to assume up, up ahead, somewhere, they're having to clear an accident, and so all of the traffic, we're sitting straight behind, , a police vehicle.

[00:10:28] Anywho, uh, let's talk about the relationship. If you're creating portraits, the one ingredient that you cannot get away without to create a great portrait is a connection with your client.

[00:10:43] When you connect with your client, when you create that magic between you, , then something happens and yes, you need beautiful light, of course you do, but in that moment, that split second when they look down the lens and you, uh, fire the shutter, if you have some kind of connection with your client, people who see that picture later will feel it.

[00:11:08] It's a really subtle thing, but it's all about what happens when somebody else sees the picture. Because remember when you're holding a camera and you grab that shot. The ultimate consumer of the image isn't you. Yes, all right, you've got the camera, there's that moment, you can show the client if that's your particular workflow, , all of these things, but what you're doing is , you're going to show that image or the image is going to be shown by your client to somebody else.

[00:11:34] Normally, that's how it works.

[00:11:36] And if you've got that magical connection between you and the person in front of the camera, that connection seems to flow out to someone who views the image later. That's where the magic happens, and you really have to do it fast too. , when people come into our studio, we have an entire workflow that is based around getting our client to relax, getting them to feel comfortable.

[00:12:03] And we are starting to create a very temporary but very powerful relationship. It's not, it's not a love affair, but it is that sort of some kind of rapport. Where. You can have a conversation, you can laugh, you can maybe learn a little bit about someone, which is always lovely. And when you do that, when you pick up the camera, you, that sort of momentum of that relationship carries through.

[00:12:28] So if you tell 'em to look down the lens, it has a, a magic to it if you're tell, even if you're telling them to look slightly to the side or down, that still has a body language to it that feels comfortable. So for me and the kind of portraiture that I love, it's that. relationship that you build, that connection in the moment you hit the button, and that is the most important thing about a portrait, and it's beautiful.

[00:12:53] And I said this to my client, and I really hope he sort of thought, oh, okay, that's a, that's a, you know, useful answer. I don't know whether, , I think he might just be making chit chat, same, because it was, he's the client, and so that's the rapport, right? So instead of me asking the questions of it, he was asking questions, , of me.

[00:13:11] Anyway, there you go. Key ingredient other than light is a relationship, the connection with your sitter.

Masteringportraitphotography.com Launch

[00:13:19] Paul In The Defender: I know this is a short one as I'm pottling along, but I also wanted to take the opportunity in this podcast to formally, as much as, you know, anything is formal with me, to formally launch masteringportraitphotography.

[00:13:33] com. Now of course the website has been there for an eternity. It's been there pretty much ever since we launched the book. Actually on the book there might be some news coming, but I'll keep you posted if and when contracts get signed. , But the website's been there, it's had sort of content, but we've really only used it primarily for the podcast as its spiritual home.

[00:13:58] Yes, there's lots of articles, there've been tons of articles, , but we've never really used it as our first and foremost focus.

[00:14:14] Mastering Portrait Photography is now very much in our viewfinder, if you like, if you like the metaphor, and we are pushing a huge amount of energy and content into it. So every month there will be a long form video. By long form I mean half an hour. Video, uh, talking about something, uh, I think the ones that are up there at the moment, like I said, I'm in the Land Rover, and while I did make some notes, uh, prior to clipping on the microphone, I didn't make all of them, so I think there is how to structure a shoot is on there, uh, I think there is how to work in harsh sunlight in there, , I know the one that's on the editing screens at the moment is five ideas for off camera flash, oh, we're all speeding up again now.

[00:14:57] We're So it's about to get a little bit more background noise. They must have rescued whatever vehicle it was. , and so, uh, you get one long form video a month. There will also be an article a month, or every couple of weeks, with a lighting diagram. On top of that, there are the frame, room, whatever you want to call them, mock ups, where they are photorealistic Photoshop files that you can drop your own image into, and it just looks like that's how the image was put on a wall. Why do we do those? Well, originally it was to help sell, , wall art to our clients. Because obviously as a business, I need ways of getting them to visualize the, uh, the wall art that I'd like them to have. And the closer I can get it to photorealistic, the better it is.

[00:15:50] Because they'll, they can't touch it. Because. That we haven't made it yet. And the old adage in sales, if they can touch it, they'll buy it. , we can't quite get there, but we can certainly visualize it. So that's really good. , and that's why we built them. I built them for my own team and everything about the website, Mastering Portrait Photography.com is of and for us, I built it or we built it to support us as a business.

[00:16:17] The articles, some of it came out of the book, but then much of the rest of it. It's been to help train people, it's been to help train my own team when we've got assistants in, , the room mock ups or the art mock ups are entirely built for us. They were built for us to be able to improve our sales, and that works.

[00:16:38] Make no bones about it, they work. You can see them, there's hundreds of them, we're building more all the time, , Oh, this bit's bumpy. The thing about recording in a Land Rover is if the road, the M40, as it is, has a rubbish road surface, which it does at this particular bit, , then it gets a little bit shaky.

[00:16:56] You can hear everything rattling around. And so we built them to be photorealistic. We built them for us. There's tons of them, but there's actually a by product which I didn't necessarily anticipate. So while I'm building these things, I drop images into them all the time. I go back to my sort of stock of portfolio images, some of my favorite images, my favorite clients over the years.

[00:17:17] And I drop them in, , to create, , thumbnails that when you browse the site you can have a look at. , but actually what I've learned, or I'm learning as I go, is how different styles of image work in different types of frame. So certain images work great big on a wall. You know, I think as photographers We're drawn towards the idea of the Mona Lisa type portrait photograph, or at least I am.

[00:17:43] I love a headshot. I love a clean, big, bold, you know, almost as if it was an LP album cover. Uh, I think, you know, Bruce Springsteen or Peter Gabriel, that's I'm sure my age, I suppose, , on an album cover, something like that, I think would be just brilliant. But would my client really put that huge on their wall?

[00:18:04] Well, they might if it's Bruce Springsteen or Peter Gabriel. They're unlikely to if it's them. Now, they might if they have an only child and they might if it's a picture of a dog. There's some amazing photographers out there doing pet photography and I can, and certainly when we do it too, you know, I can visualize how one of our dog photographs, for instance, might appear in a big frame on a wall.

[00:18:28] I was with a client and an old friend of mine the other day and they had a A picture on the wall. It's one of Randall Ford's pictures. , and I know the family and their dogs and, and, uh, the dad. And I just think I could do exactly that with, uh, his dogs and his family. , something big and bold. A couple of frames lined up across the wall, but on the whole, if you are gonna sell big frames, single big frames, you probably want groups in there.

[00:18:56] Now, if you've got clients with huge walls and. You know, a couple of kids, you might be able to put individual headshots into individual frames on the wall, and I do have clients like that, and they look stunning, my oh my, do I love it. Uh, but they're not the norm, they're not the norm. The norm is a normal sized house, with moderate sized walls, and if you put a big frame up on the wall, it's either got to be something like a fine art piece, where, let's say, The couple are silhouetted against the wall, small, but there's a big sky or something, , or a picture of a dog, or a picture of, you know, the two kids, or the whole family.

[00:19:35] It's highly likely that they're going to want something full of joy and laughter, because that is something that would be appealing at that size on a wall. Similarly, if you're laying up three frames, you can tell a story across them. You can use a different star a different type of image. You can use individual shots in a different way.

[00:19:52] For more information visit www. paulwilkinsonphotography. com , if you put three acrylics on a wall, you can triptych across it, so you have one picture that's spread across the three acrylics, and that could look super creative, uh, really, really interesting way to do it, , and all of this, my understanding of this side of it is increasing all the time, because I'm laying out using these mock ups, so on top of them being brilliant as a sales tool for you and for your clients, they're also a really creative thing to play with, just trying different ideas, And seeing how they look.

[00:20:25] So that's the room mockups on the website. There's also, of course, the podcast, this very thing that you're listening to, that's the spiritual home for it. Even if you're listening to this on iTunes or on Spotify or on YouTube. The spiritual home for it is masteringportraitphotography.com.

Upcoming Workshops and Events

[00:20:43] Paul In The Defender: And then the final section, or the main section is the academy.

[00:20:47] And this is now where all of our workshops, , are going to be. So, uh, while I'm on that topic, I'll just reel off the workshops that we have already got, uh, to book in the diary. Now these have got, uh, people have already started booking on them, , we only put them up a week or two ago. Uh, so on January the 20th, January the 20th, we've got an Off Camera Flash Workshop.

[00:21:14] Uh, funnily enough, one of the toughest topics to teach, uh, but also one of the most rewarding techniques to learn. , so we did, uh, we are in the process of releasing a video on it that will go on, a long form video that will go onto the website, uh, and that is a deep dive into some ideas of what you can do with off camera flash.

[00:21:33] I think people are a bit afraid of it because it's, , a little bit technical, but once you get your head around it and what you can do with it, you can do anything from create really natural, almost available light portraits but with stunning light wherever you are all the way through to theatrical halloween images with smoke machines and all of the paraphernalia and they're all in this video and the workshop on january the 20th is going to cover that ground it's Off Camera Flash we may or may not include some continuous lighting but at the moment the plan is for it to be Off Camera Flash but if the delegates ask to also cover continuous light then we could do Some of that because of course every workshop we run we tune it to the delegates We tell you broadly what the topic is going to be and then through the feedback we get in the Early forms that you submit and we can tune it if you want to

[00:22:27] It's the joy of having a studio. I guess we can do anything we want to as long as everybody's happy with that on March the 31st, we have a Mastering Headshots Workshop, so As it says, it's all about headshot. It's all about, uh, the, uh, for me, I think one of the purest, most beautiful forms of portraiture. I love doing headshot. They're my favorite, uh, thing to do.

[00:22:51] I think it, I dunno why I, maybe it's 'cause I've always been fascinated with faces and a headshot is simply an excuse to photograph a face. So that's headshots on, uh, April the 14th. So the headshots is March the 31st, April the 14th. We have got dogs and owners. We're photographing dogs with their owners for a day.

[00:23:11] , Of course, during that we will take some pictures of the dogs on their own. We will also take some pictures of the owners on their own. But primarily it's targeted at how to photograph dogs in conjunction with their, uh, their owners. Why do we do that? Well, most of our clients would wish to have a shot with the dog.

[00:23:32] That's the best shot you can get. , not all, we have plenty of clients that just want the dog photographed, but we also have plenty of clients, one in particular of the day, brilliant, oh man, one of my favorite sessions, Vivienne, who has given me permission to talk about and show the shoots. Vivienne came with her dog Dodie, tiny little West Highland Terrier, who contrary to my Nan's West Highland Terrier that used to bite my toes, this dog was the best behaved dog in the world.

[00:23:59] PAULWILKINSONPHOTOGRAPHY. COM , followed her everywhere she went, but also would just wander off and get inquisitive and then immediately return. A beautiful dog, beautiful shots, and she booked us specifically for one thing. She said, I can find people who shoot their dog on their own, I can find plenty of portrait photographers, only one photographer came up who quite openly and on the website said, yeah, we can photograph a dog with their owner, and I do it all the time with the hearing dogs, why wouldn't I?

[00:24:25] , I think it's a really lovely thing, and the shots of her. They're off the top of the scale. So that is April the 14th, Dogs and Owners. Uh, and then, this is a completely new thing. On May the 12th and 13th, we we have a two day bootcamp Now what's a bootcamp? Well, basically, it's as much stuff as we can fit in over two days. And we get the chance in the evening to have some food, maybe have a drink, have a chat, be together as a group. , We don't have accommodation at the studio, uh, but we certainly have plenty around us. So that will be, uh, two days, , either at our studio or somewhere local.

[00:25:06] , depending on what we decide exactly where it'll be. But it will certainly be within a mile or two of, of where we are based two days. That's two days back to back a maximum of 10 people. So it's a few more than our normal. Uh, workshops, but it'll be pretty intense. We're gonna cover all sorts of ground, , using available light, using studio light, using off camera flash, maybe a bit of post production thrown into the mix, again, depending on what the delegates, the delegates would like to cover.

[00:25:34] It's gonna be an absolute blast, cannot wait for that one. It's the first time we've run it, , and it's such a smart idea, it's Sarah's idea to do it. , as always, the smart ideas come from Sarah, uh, and, uh, looking forward to that one. That's May 12th and 13th. And then the final one that's available at the moment, right now, is June the 9th.

[00:25:52] We are doing our regular jaunt, uh, we're gonna dance to the weather, see what we get, uh, on location in Oxford. Now this workshop, I think, might be, might be my favourite, because it's just me with a camera, with some people to photograph, on a location. That's it. We don't carry a load of kit, don't carry particularly reflectors and lights, we just go and find locations, find light pools and patches, find stories to tell.

[00:26:24] We just go and photograph our models in Oxford on location. So that's on June 9th. And all of these workshops are now home, housed, ha ha, can't even say it, are now located, let's try that, are now located on masteringportraitphotography. com. We've moved everything over because that was always what we were building with the workshops.

[00:26:50] , originally it was under Paul Wilkinson Photography, uh, but we always knew, , and had, and had a reasonably openly talked about this, Always knew that we'd be moving it across to Mastering Portrait Photography. 'cause that's the place that's all about learning, all about teaching, all about enjoying and exploring portrait photography.

[00:27:10] So if you go to mastering portrait photography.com, there's a, a section called the Academy. So there's all these sections. There's The Visual Vault, that's all of the articles. There's The Podcast, there's, uh, The Resources, which is, , the mockups and , tools, Photoshop downloads and things. And then there is the, uh, Academy.

[00:27:31] And this is where you'll find the workshops. Exactly the same booking process as before. Everything's as it was, it's just now hosed, ha ha ha, it's just now located on masteringportraitphotography. com. Now, for the articles and the videos and the mock ups, at the moment the mock ups are 9. 99 each, uh, which is already a bargain, there's a few free ones, just so you can get an idea, uh, so they're about a tenner each, , there's a few backgrounds, I'm working on building more backgrounds as I need them, but mostly it's the mock ups.

[00:28:02] So they're a tenner, which is a bargain, you can create them, you can put them in magazines, you can use them on your website. It just shows your prospective or your existing clients how their images might look. A tenner. Bargain. However, there's a bigger bargain. I suddenly sound like a salesman. So sorry, it's because I'm driving.

[00:28:21] And I want to give you not one, but two bargains. It sounds like that. Anyway, if you become a subscriber of Mastering Portrait Photography, you get access to the videos. , and you get access to the downloads. And you get access, well, to everything we put on there, except the workshops. We charge separately for those.

[00:28:39] But you get access to all of the resources for 6. 99 a month, which is an even bigger bargain. So even if you only want to download a few of the room mock ups, it's still better to keep a subscription going at 6. 99 a month. It's less than an expensive cup of coffee. And, uh, we will keep the mock ups coming, we will keep the articles coming, we will keep the videos coming, so you'll always have value for money for your 6.99. If you're feeling a bit more, you know, a bit, you have a bit more conviction, then it's 69 quid, or 69. 99 a year, so that's 12 months for the price of 10. Uh, 10 percent saving, or whatever that is, 2 out of 12. Is it a 10? Yeah, it's a 10 percent saving. Is it? No, it's not. It's, I don't know what it is. It's two twelfths.

[00:29:25] There you go. It's one sixth. No! Which is a great saving. My maths isn't good enough, uh, while I'm driving. I can't concentrate. I'm concentrating on the road, as I should be, by the way. Uh, so it's 6. 99 a month, , or 69. 99 per year. So head over to masteringportraitphotography. com, , and we promise, we promise we'll make it worth your while.

[00:29:48] Oh, sorry, all of our members also. Uh, you get access to our Facebook community. Which is hidden and private. You can't get onto it any other way. , only people who are part of our community can be in there. And that way people can ask for critiques. People can ask for advice and tips is where we put discount codes for things.

[00:30:07] , like software where we have, uh, access to discounts from suppliers, those kinds of things. They all go onto the Facebook community. I know a few of you aren't on Facebook, and if I'm honest, it's not my favorite thing. Because I'm just a dopamine idiot when it comes to social media. Once I'm on it, I can't get off it.

[00:30:26] , however, it's the best way to do this to be, so you don't have to log into multiple places to find information. It's on our Facebook community, uh, and most of us have a Facebook account. So you see the, , the alerts come up when things, uh, are uploaded. So that is masteringportraitphotography. com. If you want to find the workshops, Head across there and go to the academy.

[00:30:47] You can Google Mastering Portrait Photography Academy or mastering portrait photography workshops. , they're a little bit lower down the rankings at the moment because obviously I've spent my entire life saying just Google Paul Wilkinson Photography workshops and everyone heads over there. So, uh, you might just have to scroll down, uh, one or two line items and we'll be there.

[00:31:05] Uh, that will change more and more of you. Uh, search for it and click on the link. So search for mastering portrait photography workshops or Mastering Portrait Photography Academy and you will. Find us.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

[00:31:15] Paul In The Defender: And that's it for me. The traffic is free flowing. There's cars going everywhere. The light is dimming.

[00:31:20] They're salting the roads. They must be expecting some cold weather. It's a beautiful, beautiful afternoon. It's been a wonderful evening of celebrating photography. I am thrilled, thrilled to bits that I've rounded off my three years with setting up the most incredible monthly photo competition and also, of course, the surprise and honor.

[00:31:46] So on that happy note, I hope you're all well, I hope things are treating you nicely, and until next time, whatever else, be kind to yourself. Take care. P. S. Sorry if this sounds a bit shouty, but when you're driving a Land Rover, it's really loud, and I forget that although I'm mic'd up, or I forget rather that because I'm mic'd up, it might sound weirdly, like I'm simply yelling!

[00:32:27] That's because I'm traveling at Sixty mile an hour in a Land Rover Defender, so apologies if I'm shouting. Be kind to yourself. Take care. Bye.

Well, this hasn't been the easiest of years with inflation, geographical tensions and all-out confrontations, terrible weather and political transitions.  And last night the trusty Land Rover Defender broke down one more time.  Possibly one LAST time.

But through all of that, we have to look for the possibles - the light at the end of the tunnel.  But maybe it's us that has to create, rather than simply walk toward, the light.  

 

Enjoy!

 

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

EP156 - Creating Light At The End Of The Tunnel

[00:00:00] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: It's Sunday afternoon. It's late. It's getting dark. It's getting dark so early now. Um, Sarah finds it really depressing, but I love this time of year. I love the colors. I love the cool of the air. Though that said this has been well, a weekend of ups and downs. Uh, yesterday we photographed a beautiful wedding. Uh, Hannah and Tom, one of our clients, just the most stunning. Stunning day.

[00:00:25] Sarah came with me because it was a bit of a handful. It was a lot of photography to get through far more far, far more. In fact, Then I would have liked to have agreed to. But in the end, it was one of those very complicated weddings where there was family from all over the world. And they wanted lots of different combinations of groups to be photographed in a very small space of time.

[00:00:46] But they were the. The most incredible couple, the weather was beautiful. The venue were fantastic. The people there were amazing. And it was just, well, it was just a thrill to have Sarah at working alongside me, which made everything. Okay. Uh, the day before we'd spent with Jake, where. So we've gone up to Nottingham, stayed there for the night, had a wonderful night out and discovered amongst many other things, the magic of a wine bar that has vending machines, kid you not. So you put your card in. Uh, you can get a glass from any bottle of wine you like. And it was all just really, really lovely bit expensive, but really lovely. I also discovered the magic. Now I've not experienced these before I am 55 years old. And have never needed to use them.

[00:01:29] Blister plasters. Yep. Blister plasters. So I bought a pair of Converse, uh, decided for a change to have a different style. And it turns out to be a style that cuts the hell out of the back of my feet. Uh, but didn't discover that until two hours into walking around Nottingham. So Sarah, obviously, a bit more used to these things than me having worn heels, um, showed me the glory that is a blister plastic. I'm still wearing them. They're great.

[00:01:54] Anyway, an amazing day, a beautiful wedding, the following day. And then driving home. Last night, congratulating ourselves on having done a really good day's work, beautiful photographs, uh, into, uh, on the memory cards. Land Rover all packed up, um, and then proceeded to have a whole series of really irritating road closures, motorway closures queues, culminating in one

[00:02:21] that turned out to be well, possibly the end of the Land Rover we're queuing and have been queuing for about half an hour. But by queuing. I mean, we're essentially stationary, just stop starting. And then I went to put it into first gear. Nothing. Absolutely no way of getting it into first gear. I've got my foot on the clutch, lift the clutch, nothing. Put my foot down, the pedal is staying stuck to the floor.

[00:02:47] So I've got a couple of tons of land Rover in a single lane queue that no one can get round me. And it's not moving.

[00:02:55] Now. I remember an old trick. My dad taught me. And I don't know why. Why this was a tricky taught me because we don't have, or didn't have at that time. Anywhere near where I lived level crossings with no gates, but he said, if you ever get stuck on a level crossing and you can't for some reason, get your car to start, or it's just stalled, put it into first gear. Turn over the starter motor and it will give you just enough power to get yourself out of that situation.

[00:03:24] So I just very quickly thought, well, I'm blocking an already irate queue, cause we've all been stuck there for, for hours. Um, I can maybe get it over to the side of the road where I can call recovery. So I turned the engine off, wedged the gear stick into first where the engine, uh, stationary turned it over on the starter motor, which of course with the clutch being permanently engaged now. Uh, rolled the wheels and got me just enough movement to get out of the way of the barely moving traffic and onto the hard shoulder, up to the embankment, where Sarah and I proceeded to look like for the next five hours.

[00:04:04] I kid you not it's cold. It's dark. Thankfully, this time. I'm like the last time I broke down like this. It isn't snowing. Uh, but we lay with as many layers on as we could and a high vis vest over the top with our feet. Um, strapped into boots, but also now in polythene bags to try and keep the cold at bay, because it was absolutely freezing.

[00:04:23] We're laying on the embankment, up to the rear and above the Land Rover. And anyone who must have seen us and they all must have seen us. Cause we're wearing, high-vis looked like a pair of corpses. Just lying there in the Moonlight. It must've been a strain site, but given the RAC who came to recover us, took five hours and they took five hours, because all of the recovery vehicles were involved in re in, sorting out the crash that caused the motorway to close, which is the reason I was in a queue. So it's one of those very complicated things. But in the end. It culminated in Sarah and I lying side by side, like two corpses in a crime drama. Uh, it must've been a dump site, you know, the kind of thing the police say, wow, this isn't where they died, this must be the dumpsite. Um, and they've left them laying here on the embankment in homage to the Land Rover. I've no idea. I was very glad Sarah was there. Um, so in fits and starts, we slept eventually we got picked up at about, uh, I think it was about four o'clock in the morning, maybe half past four in the morning, um, and then, uh, took the recovery vehicle. The Landrover is right now sitting outside the garage that did the work on the engine earlier in the year. They're going to know the minute they turn up that something is wrong. My suspicion and I hope I'm wrong. Is that the slave cylinder on the clutch has failed because if it has, it means the whole transmission and gearbox has got to come out. And that's a proper, yet another expensive job.

[00:05:52] And. I think maybe, maybe this will be the one that says the end of the Land Rover. I'm Paul. And this is the masteringportraitphotography.com podcast.

[00:06:03] Well, hello again. We are back recording the podcast. And once again, it's a tale of woe and drama. Sarah said to me, as I left, she said, you need to record a podcast because you haven't done it for ages. She said, it's all right. It's all right. To feel a little less upbeat than you do normally. And that's just as well this year. I think this year is a year that I'll be happy to get to the end of, we started this year with such energy and enthusiasm.

[00:06:50] We thought that. You know, we're getting to the end of the backwash from COVID, everything would pick up, but of course, inflation hit the roof. We've had in terms of weather, just awful weather, which always deflates the mood. We've had a general election In this country, as well as in the states that you're about to have yours and we've already had ours. Which I thought would , would Herald in good news and optimism. Um, you know, I think it was time we had to change. There's no question about that. And no matter which side of the politic line, uh, you prefer, there's no question at all that we needed to change, but that changed that the good news side of that hasn't lasted particularly long. Um, Inflation is still high.

[00:07:28] The weather is still crappy. Seriously, we've had nothing but rain. I was so blessed with the wedding on Saturday. Um, the sun shone, and it was glorious. It was dry. It was warm enough. Um, it was just beautiful light. But that has not been the story of this year. The amount of water around us, just at the moment.

[00:07:48] And nobody's thinking when they wake up and read the news about the terrible weather, the terrible economy. They're politicians causing just all, just doing stupid things. You know, inflation, um, the stuff going on in the middle east or stuff going on in, on the Russian borders. You know, very few people are gonna wake up and think, oh, with all of that news do you know what I need what I need is a photographer. It's uh, there's work around, but it's just not the year we thought it would be, this is not been. A vintage year for photographers.

[00:08:18] And he really don't have to ask very far to find that out. Now we've done. All right. If I'm honest we're probably bucking the trend, but we have had to work, ah, back-breaking hours to do it far harder then we've had to work any of the year. It won't be a record breaking year, that's for that's for sure. But it will be good enough somewhere in the middle of our regular numbers, but we have worked tirelessly to do it. Backbreakingly tirelessly.

[00:08:47] I cannot remember feeling this tired though, having said that. I've just spent the night laying on an embankment in the freezing cold, trying to get some sleep. Maybe that's why I'm feeling. I quite so tired, but even talking to the videographer. Uh, on at the wedding on Saturday, he was talking about the bits of the industry in his region because we were working out of region and he was saying the same thing.

[00:09:10] There's just. It's just been a tough year. There. Aren't the number of weddings. For instance, if you're a wedding photographer. Um, and there isn't the money sloshing around at the has been, um, Sort of in the industry with our clients because our clients are under the same pressure as we are. I was trying to work out our operating costs. Um, on things like, you know, albums and frames.

[00:09:32] And I think on average, somewhere in the region of 15 to 25% increase, over two years. And if you put that into the context of running a business, And, and also assume that your clients are having exactly the same problems with their day-to-day expenditure. It means that we're running a business that's less profitable than it would be if we don't change our prices, but at a time when people have less money to spend. If we did increase all of our prices and of course we're all juggling that particular set of requirements.

[00:10:04] Uh, and on top of that, of course, one of the reasons we're also feeling tired. Is we're still running workshops. Uh, I'm still at the moment, the, uh, Chair of awards and qualifications for the British Institute of Professional Photography.

[00:10:17] But. Um, I mean, big news on that one is I am stepping down from that role at the end of this year. Now I've loved every single second of the past three or so years I've been in this seat.

[00:10:29] Uh, I've done everything that I wanted to do. We've organized it. We've got the standards where I wanted them to be, so that they're rock solid. You can trust if somebody got the letters after their name from. The BIPP then they've earned them. Um, and that means that we have real cute OSS in the industry. It means it's something that people really want to attain.

[00:10:49] And that's, I guess what I wanted to be able to do. But I also loved being a mentor. And while I was chair of one of the qualifications bodies, it's very hard. To be a mentor because it can be really easily accused that I might be, um, swaying results or influencing the outcome of judging.

[00:11:08] So I took the decision when I accepted . The chair of judge's role that I would not to do any mentoring towards qualifications or anything involved with people wanting to enter the competitions and things, because it just, it didn't look great,

[00:11:21] But it's something I've always. Really enjoyed doing so it's something I can return to. I'll get a chance now to actually enjoy looking at other people's work, um, guiding, nurturing, you know, also spending some time developing our own work because you need at the same time, I need the time to dedicate to our own businesses for a little bit.

[00:11:41] So I'm stepping back. At least, you know, in a frontline role. Uh, from, um, the chairing side of the BIPP. Hopefully I'll still get to judge, but I certainly won't be chairing it. Uh, we're still running the workshops, of course, on that note, uh, I think we have just two left this year. .

[00:11:58] So the thing without podcast is our podcasts have a very long lifespan.

[00:12:03] People are listening to podcasts from sort of six or seven years ago. Uh, but as of right now, which is the 28th of September, I think. Hang on a minute. Which I can't believe I had to go look that up on my screen, the 29th of September. Uh, 2024, we have two remaining workshops in our diary. I think there's one space left on each off the top of my head.

[00:12:26] Uh, on the 4th of November, we have Mastering Advanced Studio Lighting, which is, I might actually have become my favorite workshop to run because we just play: we play with lights.

[00:12:40] We play with ideas with form. Uh, we play with shape and color. We play with the smoke machines that people want to, we play with continuous light if people want to. Um, of course, as an Elinchrom Ambassador, that nearly all of it is geared around strobes. You name it? If it's in the studio, we can do it. And I absolutely adore this workshop.

[00:12:59] I think there's a space left on that last, the 4th of November. It's an all day course. Uh, all day workshop, sorry. Uh, and then the second one we have, which is a brand new workshop. We've never tried this before and we'll see how this goes. Having spent the night lying on an embankment last night, I'm not so certain. I want to be outside at night for a while. However, it's at the end of November 25th. Of November. We have a mastering day and night workshop. Now this workshop. Is one, uh, I think it might've been Sarah's idea. Uh, If it's successful. It was my idea. If it doesn't work, definitely Sarah's idea.

[00:13:36] No, I think it was Sarah's idea and I think it's a great idea. Uh, Mastering Day and Night. So we start unlike most of our workshops where we start at sort of 9, 9 30 in the morning. That this one. We're going to start straight after lunch. We're going to spend the afternoon working with daylight and then as dusk falls. We're going to work with a nighttime scene.

[00:13:55] So it's not really a, it's not studio lighting, but we might use some lighting. Depending on what the delegates want. So we're going to mix it up a little bit. We're going to spend a half the workshop working with available daylight and half the workshop working with a combination. Um, of available light, which of course won't be daylight, but it might be street lighting. Um, or light coming from people's porches and those kinds of things working around the village.

[00:14:21] We'll also have some lights with us. Just as I did at the wedding yesterday, I see. In this slide. Here's an aside. Uh, yesterday working with the videographer I had in the land Rover. Uh, I had to Elinchrom threes, which I thought we would work with. Cause I love them. Absolutely amazing lights. And I thought we'd do some stroke work. Um, but I also had a pair of aperture. Uh, continuous focusing, uh, spots, focusing spotlights led spotlights.

[00:14:47] They really quite chunky. Um, and they throw off who wrote the most beautiful light as well. Um, and so I said to the videographer, um, we might do some nighttime photography and he looked a little bit glum and he said, yeah, you mean with strobes? Don't you? And I said, well, do you want to do anything with it?

[00:15:02] So, yeah, I'd really, I'd really like to be able to capture some of that. So I'll tell you what, why don't we run the two spotlights were run continuous lighting for this one. Because working with a videographer, it makes it a little bit easier for you. Um, and while I'd still prefer to be using my Elinchrom Threes, there's no reason why we can't do something at least similar. Um, with continuous light, so threw a spotlight and had a play at night.

[00:15:23] And the reaction from Richard, the videographer. It was just brilliant. He took one for, oh, it's not a photo who's doing. Slow-mo. High-speed video. And he just went. Wow.

[00:15:36] And then everything I set up, he wanted. Like sort of five seconds of slow motion video of it. Um, moving around cause you get lens flan, all of those things. So we were creating very similar vibes that you can do with stills and a strobe, uh, with continuous light and uh, in his case with video. So it was quite exciting to do that. Um, anyway, back to Mastering Day Night, we will be using a mix of different lighting, maybe a bit of off-camera flash, depending on what people ask for.

[00:16:00] Um, Now. On the topic of workshops next year, we're looking at. Um, some new ideas and that if there's anything you'd like to, uh, like us to host, so you think would be fun, then please do drop us a line. You can always get ahold of me on paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk dot code at UK. That's paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk .

[00:16:22] If there's something you can think of that, do you know what it'd be great. If you could run a day on whatever it is. As long as it's photographic people, not animals. And not buildings, not landscapes. I'm not good at all of those things, but it's photographing people. Uh, understanding light then of course, why not drop us a line?

[00:16:41] Um, one of the ones we're already looking at, and this I'd be curious if anyone's interested. Um, we haven't got dates for these yet, but we are looking to do. A two day workshop. That's a back-to-back workshop. Um, Now I don't yet. So we haven't quite worked out yet. What will go into those two days, but we know, we know it's just going to be. Uh, blast. And of course, with it being over two days in the interim evening, we get to sit. Have a meal, maybe have a few drinks. And chat about photography and not quite sure. Um, what the format will be.

[00:17:16] My guess at this stage is, uh, the very least. A day and a half of photography and then half a day may be. On workflow or maybe on Photoshop or maybe on Lightroom. Uh, maybe the use of AI tools, which of course are now a considerable part of all of our workflow. I don't know. I honestly don't know. We're still working it out um, for those of you who are part of our workshop community people who've been on our workshops. We've sent you a quick survey. Um, which we'd love to hear your thoughts on for those of you who listened to podcast, but never been on one of our workshops. Again, if you have an idea, and you think that might be fun to come along to, uh, please do drop me a line.paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk . Uh, of course alongside all of this. And another reason why you might hear the fatigue in my voice. I think today I can be excused. All right. I think today. I'm allowed to sound a little bit weary because having laid for five hours on an embankment next to a slow moving motorway. Um, until like four or five in the morning. I think I'm all right to feel to, to justifiably sound a little bit fatigued, but we're also running a couple of different businesses and one of the things we're still working on and I'm still reworking is the mastering portrait photography website, still a few bits to sort out.

[00:18:36] So those of you. Who do go on and off the website, apologies for things moving around as we're doing this. , I had an email the other day that said, do you know your shops down? Um, and for every user that I tested on the shop was just fine. Uh, but for just one or two uses, not so much. Um, I had to go digging around in some code. Uh, to find a one-line and do you know what it turned out to be?

[00:18:57] It was a line I'd put in to debug the rest of it. The rest of it was fine, but the line of debug code was glitching. It's just. Oh, I hate it when that happens. It's an old school. Uh, cockup . When you put in test code and it's the test code that causes the problem. Uh, so never mind apologies for that.

[00:19:16] Uh, so. But we will keep you posted. There's lots of new articles and there's going to be regular videos and all sorts of. Uh, features on their rolling forwards. Uh, sad news this past couple of weeks, is that the incredible NPhoto magazine, which I just loved writing for has stopped publishing. What a shame I'm gutted about it.

[00:19:37] I've loved every time they've asked me to write for them. And so it's just been, um, I dunno, it's just been part of my monthly activities is to sit down. Tapping the, uh, figurative pen on my teeth and wondering what to write. And of course it being about Nikon and my love of Nikon. It's been a real pleasure to do, however, as with all of these things, when doors close, other doors open and it looks like there's a chance, at least that I'll be writing for an even bigger online title. Um, They approached me. Um, some of the same editors were involved in the new, well, not a new sites and established site, but they've moved over from their role at NPhoto, into new roles. Um, and they reached out to see if I'd be interested. In putting together some ideas to write for that.

[00:20:25] So. Um, like I said, you know, some doors close and while I'm really sad and photo has gone. Um, then, uh, maybe just maybe another door is, uh, opening. I've just got to figure out what angle to take on it, because it's a really open, brief, as long as it's interesting. Um, then he said, I can pretty much talk about anything.

[00:20:44] I like. So, whether it's business or techniques may be creative ideas, I don't know. Um, the state of the industry, AI post-processing. I honestly don't know, but one thing they have said. Is I could do with writing some things that are slightly contentious, at least in the sense that they can create a little quote that, uh, will get people out of bed and engaged . There's some ways, many of the things, um, I'm not that good acts.

[00:21:11] I don't know. That I'm particularly contentious. I did get in a, it was a wonderful review. We had at one of our workshops through the day. Um, and the review said. It's just great. And he said he really appreciated the fact that I was ever so slightly irreverent sometimes. Uh, which I think is about as far as I would get, I don't know. That I'm known for being particularly contentious, but it might be something I have to get my head round.

[00:21:37] They also said I'm going to need. Good headlines now, for those of you who are regulars with the podcast, you'll know that one of my weak spots is I'm not very good at writing. Headlines. That's just not my scale. Just definitely not good at it. I try I've even tried just one of the few things that I've tried, getting chat, GPT input on.

[00:21:56] So dear Chat, GPT. Uh, please give me some, uh, I dunno, punchy headlines for this article. And when it comes back with just they're even worse than the ones that I write. So I've come back to writing my own. Um, that's definitely not my skill and the editors I've been working with whenever they've taken my articles, they've written far, far better headlines than I ever have.

[00:22:19] So hopefully they'll look after that, but it was there. In the brief. Um, so, you know, I'm gonna have to learn some new skills, enough to be a bit contentious. I want to write some better headlines. I'm just gonna have to get my head down and, learned some new stuff, but here's the point. No matter just how rough this year has been.

[00:22:37] And I think in some ways, at least psychologically, this has been a tougher year than some of the ones we've been through recently COVID well, that was out of our control. Um, coming out of COVID. Well, everybody knew it was going to be tricky. But now, with so little reason for it to be quite so tough.

[00:22:59] At least there's no. I mean, I know there are reasons for it. I'm not saying there aren't. But it just feels like there should have been a better year. But at the end of the day, there's only so long people can be depressed, whether it's me, whether it's my team, whether it's our clients or whether it's the bigger world, the greater world. In general, there always has to be. Light at the end of the tunnel, but here's the but, weirdly. I suspect that light at the end of the tunnel is the light that we put there ourselves. It's almost like a mirror being held up. So that it reflects back the light that you have to generate, and that's not an easy trick, particularly when you know, I'm facing yet another land Rover breakdown and possibly the Last land Rover Defender breakdown.

[00:23:50] I'm not entirely certain that at the end of this year, we'll still have a Defender. I don't know how I can have a car, that I'm worried is going to break down every time I head out on to a gig. Um, But it is the trick that I'm going to have to master, to be, to have light at the end of the tunnel. It will be me that has to create it.

[00:24:09] And it has to be reflected back at me. I have a suspicion. That's just the only way to do it. If you can't create the light, there's nothing out there to run to. And I intend to run towards the light. So in spite of the rain, the time pressures, rather buggered, Land Rover Defender. Ultimately it's down to me. To shine, a light that I am running towards, and I'm going to choose that light.

[00:24:36] I'm going to make that light. I am gonna look for the new opportunities. I'm gonna. put, together new workshops. I'm going to focus on all of the new opportunities that are thrown up over the past couple of weeks. Um, I am loving running the workshops and they are going to get bigger and stronger and more exciting.

[00:24:52] I'm loving making the website changes. To Mastering Portrait Photography, the videos that Sarah, myself and Katie are creating. Um, the time I've had to spend with the kids. And of course the incredible clients that we've been able to work with and the images that we've created so far this year, and the many more. There are to come.

[00:25:12] That's the light at the end of the tunnel and that's what we're creating.

[00:25:17] The team around me are well, frankly, fantastic. And one thing from last night is unexpectedly lying under the stars. I was lying under the stars with my wife, Sarah, who is to me. my savior. It was just not lovely. I'm not going to say it was lovely because it was so cold. Um, and so slightly depressing. Um, however, if I was going to be there with anybody, it would be there with Sarah. And so for me, that's a little high spot in what was otherwise quite a dark. Uh, at cold night,

[00:25:46] On that note, I need an early night now as I haven't had any sleep. And I have to be up early yet again. To go and explain why yet again, I'm not really happy that my clutch has failed. Less than eight months after having the entire engine and transmission, replaced. But whatever else you're doing. In this cold weather. Shine a light and be kind to yourself.

[00:26:10] Take care.

Ah, so it's the 4th July as I record this so Happy Independence Day to all my US friends and colleagues! 

 

In this episode, I do my regular round-up of things I've heard during judging - I was chairing the Click Expo Print Competition (the standard was incredible!) and I made a few notes from this and a few other things I've been involved in.

 

I mention a couple of products and here are the links:

EVOTO AI - https://go.evoto.ai/PaulWilkinson (if you use this link, you'll get 30 free credits!)

ACDSee https://www.acdsee.com/en/index/ 

DXO - https://www.dxo.com/

 

Enjoy!

 

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

EP154 - A Bit More Different (And Other Thoughts On Judging)

[00:00:00] Introduction and Warm (Water) Review

[00:00:00] So, let me read this out to you. I'm loving this podcast. It's like sitting in a bath of warm water in that the subject matter is gently flowing over you in a warm, friendly, soothing way. When I get to the end of the series, I'm going to start again. I think Sarah sends it to me, so I'm assuming it's on iTunes. So thank you to Skinny Latte via Apple Podcasts. Yes, it is. It's Apple Podcast. Who left that review. It made me laugh. I've never, ever. I don't think been compared to a bath of warm water, but Hey. It certainly, it certainly made me smile. And I will take a review worded like that. Poetry in its finest, in its finest watery form.

[00:00:43] Podcasting Challenges and Episode 154

[00:00:43] I'm Paul, and this is the Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast.

[00:00:49] Well, I blew that ambition out of the water. Didn't I, the let's do one podcast every week for the rest of the year. Uh, I've barely managed three or four, I think. It has been just one of those. years, this is episode 154. And really it's just been busy.

[00:01:23] As I record this, it's the 4th of July. So, happy 4th of July, to all of our American. Listen is in so many ways. The 4th of July might be something of an independence day for us too certainly with a little luck, a day of change.

[00:01:37] Busy Year and Listener Feedback

[00:01:37] Um, it's just been really busy in a year like this everything's working really well, but we're having to work that little bit harder to get there. Everything's a little bit more expensive. Clients have a little less to spend and somebody wrote in the other day. And said that they were waiting for episode 154. And partly because having the podcast, this podcast out there, from someone who is living and breathing the same industry that you are. It's feeling the same things that you are going through the same processes, the same client experiences that you are is comforting.

[00:02:11] And just knowing that they're not alone. So here is episode 154. In that sense, I think we really are. Um, a market, we're a collective of individuals. We're all going through the same thing, but on our own. It's useful to know. Uh, that there's other people out there going through the same thing. So I don't sleep very much. Uh, we're working flat-out I love every second of it.

[00:02:35] Don't get me wrong. Having having a camera in my hands is just the most natural thing in the world. So, and taking pictures for a living. Well, I couldn't ask for a better way to put food on the table, but that's not to say it isn't really hard work. And in fitting in all of the other things that seem to have crept up into my world. Um, it just takes a little bit of time.

[00:02:58] So apologies that the podcast has been a little bit more sporadic then I would have liked. Uh, before I get any further, I would just like to say thank you to everybody that filled in the questionnaire that Sarah has sent out. Um, It's really, really, really interesting. The data in it is incredibly insightful.

[00:03:18] And what we're trying to understand is what do we do with Mastering Portrait Photography? How do I push it and prod it and coax it forward? Um, we're due to give a really big kick this year? That's what we're trying to do, but at this stage we weren't entirely certain where to focus. So we now have an awful lot of really insightful, useful data. And the biggest thing that's come up is that it's well-worth. I know that sounds really bizarre. You know, I know people read our articles.

[00:03:48] I know people like the diagrams, our stuff is out there in Professional Photo Magazine. And this month also, In Digital Photography Magazine, you want to pick up a copy of that. On the news stand of a Professional Photo. Uh, it has gone all Digital, but Digital Photographer. Is there a paradox there that professional photo magazine is now all digital, but Digital Photography magazine, you can pick that up on it. I can't. I think there must be a paradox in there somewhere or an irony. Maybe it's an irony. I never entirely certain. The difference between an irony and a paradox. Anyway, anyway. Um, thank you to everybody who filled that in. Uh, I was due to record his podcast. This podcast was meant to be. It was meant to be a podcast from the land Rover. Uh, but it's been a very hot day.

[00:04:33] I was working. A two hour drive away. So two hour drive, half hour shoot, two hour drive back, and I was going to record one, maybe two podcasts. Um, weirdly the Landrover was more rattling than usual because, and I don't know why there is a toaster in the foot well. You know, when you get into a car and you, you, you drive away and you can either clanking rattling. There's a little Chrome toaster in my foot.

[00:04:56] Well, I need to pick that up with my son. Uh, anyway.

[00:04:59] Family Pride and Personal Updates

[00:04:59] On the topic of kids. Both my kids. I know. It's got nothing to do with photography, right. But I'm a dad and you can't help, but be proud of your children and this couple of weeks. I am beyond proud. Uh, today. Jake got his degree. Uh, Sport Technology from Loughborough University.

[00:05:18] So you got a two, one. Uh, degree in BEng. In it's literally engineering with balls, there's no other way to describe it. That's what it is. They study balls and things with which to hit balls. Cricket bats, baseball, bats, golf clubs, football boots. And then they also, uh, research things like, uh, helmets.

[00:05:37] So when the ball hits you, it stops you being an unconscious cricket player or backstop or whatever. Uh, so truly, truly a magnificent result for him really, really proud of him.

[00:05:49] And just as proud of our daughter who has for the past few weeks just started her new job, working in London for one of the biggest creative agencies, creative marketing agencies. In the UK. Um, as a creative account manager. Uh, she's just going to tear the world apart. She's super organized, super creative, super lovely to work with.

[00:06:10] She's a grafter and I could not be prouder of both of them. So forgive me for saying that and giving a shout out to my children, but Hey, my podcast. You don't have to listen to it. Uh, so where are we? Right, it has been a very busy. Uh, I think it's about six weeks since I've done an episode.

[00:06:28] Workshops and Masterclasses

[00:06:28] Um, so I cannot I've lost count. I usually I'll give you a quick count up of everything we've done. Numerous hearing dogs shoots a load of workshops and one-on-one master classes them. I just. Do you know what? I never thought. I honestly never thought I'd enjoy running workshops and masterclasses as much as I do. There's something. And I don't know why, but there's something really thrilling about being in a room with a few people who genuinely want to, uh, take ideas and create ideas and push boundaries and try things and discuss things. Um, and that's turning into actually a really, really, for me, a really rewarding part of our business.

[00:07:10] And I never, I don't know if I ever really expected that. It's, I'm certainly not one of those people. That I want, you know what, I really love doing training because it's giving something back. It's none of that. It's not that at all. There's just an incredible buzz. Of a group of people working towards creating an image and explaining. And understanding and learning how things work and why more importantly, why we do things, why it's always, everyone tells you what. You know, when you look at things online, everything's about the what and the how, but why, why do we do things?

[00:07:42] Why do we approach. Light the way we do why'd we approach the camera settings the way we do. Why, why, why, why, why? I just find the Y. So much more interesting than the what and the, how. And I think probably more valuable because if I understand why then I'll do it. If I understand the what I won't necessarily do it, it might be a useful tool or it might be a useful technique. But if I don't really get why I'm doing something, I will bin that off as just not useful.

[00:08:12] But if I understand why there's a rationale to why. And so all of our workshops and masterclasses now are premised on why. Anyway, that's a slight aside we'd last week we had a couple of students work placement students that are. Uh, 15 year old and a 17 year old. Two brilliant. Uh, young students who had approached us to come and spend. A few days with us in the studio.

[00:08:36] Military Photoshoot and Student Experiences

[00:08:36] Uh, they came with us to the hearing dogs for shoot. And then we did, um, a shoot here, uh, with, um, a guy in military uniform. Um, it's one of those, the shots. Uh, this was the perfect sheet for me. Um, a guy said, I want to do something. Really sort of vintage modern cameras, modern lighting, all the rest of it. But he sent me a couple of pictures that must've been taken.

[00:08:57] I'm going to guess in the 1940s at, I don't know the exact date, but I'm guessing around there from the style, my grandfather. Both my grandfathers had pictures like these in their military uniform. There's something about the way it's lit. Something about the way it's styled something about the way it's posed and finished.

[00:09:13] And of course it's on film, black, white film. And he said, I want to, we create these, but you know, he's a, he's a soldier. He's at the very top of what you can be if you're a noncommissioned officer. Um, and he wanted to celebrate that moment. And so we photographed these incredible images and there was a moment in the shoot, where literally the hair stood up on the back of my neck and I realized what I was looking at with the same pictures that I would have seen of my grandfather's the same styling, the same vibe, same feel.

[00:09:47] And it's a sort of, it's an almost indescribable styling that makes all of that hang together. Anyway, it was absolutely wonderful. And I would love to share them. But I can't because he works for one of the top secret, um, units in the military. So I've got these beautiful pictures. It's of a guy that I can never tell you about and never show the pictures. I can tell you I did the shoot because it's of course nobody knows. Uh, but it's a real shame, but I really, really, really enjoyed it.

[00:10:14] So now looking around for anyone with a military uniform of the similar style, That we could do something that we could do something with I can share. So if there's any of you out there who have, uh, retired from the military, but still have your number two uniform. I'd love to. Uh, love to take some pictures just for the sheer joy of doing exactly the same thing, but then I can share them. Uh, I think the students really enjoyed it too.

[00:10:38] And then the day after that, a brilliant magician . I've worked with Sam strange. Probably for 12 years, I think now. Um, incredible magician. Part of the Champions Of Magic him. Uh, Young and Strange, he works as part of a duo with Richard Young. Uh, but this was a shoot just for him. Sam Strange, wonderful guy just playing. I'm so lucky in the studio that the human beings that come in here. Uh, I think some of the nicest people in the world, I mean, I have only met a tiny proportion of the people in the world.

[00:11:08] I'm sure there are other nice people. But my client base is genuinely. Uh, just a never ending stream of people who I love to spend time with a, Sam Strange. Is right up there. So he spent ages taking pictures of him. And as, as a kind of, we wanted to get some shots where he was genuine, genuinely performing.

[00:11:25] So the two work placement students became instantaneously his audience, uh, some card tricks. He did these card tricks. One of the students looked quite confused. I'm not entirely certain that she understood what had just happened while she was holding the card with her name on it and a knife hole in it. Anyway.

[00:11:43] It was very funny and absolutely. Uh, wonderful. We've done a load of portrait shoots. The weather has been kind for a couple of weeks. Which is a pleasure. Uh, so we've been out in the sunshine, um, And just. It's just, it's. What I came into photography to do was to laugh in the sunshine, taking beautiful pictures. Uh, so that's really, really, really lovely. Um, we've been judging the monthly's the BIPP. The BIPP the British Institute of Professional Photography.

[00:12:11] Monthly's over the past couple of months. I think we've done two. Monthly since I last spoke with you, sorry. That's my bad, just busy. That's all it is. We're just busy. Um, I love doing, I love chairing the judging.

[00:12:23] And then on top of that, Um, I was asked to chair the print judging for the click expo.

[00:12:28] Judging Competitions and Photography Tips

[00:12:28] That was up in the Midlands a couple of weeks ago, some big names there, Lindsay Adler, and a few others. Uh, with some of the photographers presenting, it was. Um, it wasn't the biggest expo in the world, but we had a really good entry into the foot print competition. And the standard is out of this. World.

[00:12:45] And when you see a panel of judges, we had judges on rotation. So five judges at any one time and me chairing it. And when you see the excitement, you see the judge's eyes just light up. When they are appreciating the very best of the craft of photography, I think, you know, there's, I don't know how to explain some of this stuff.

[00:13:05] Why that, you know, that feeling when you take a picture right. And you hit the button and you just know, you just know you can feel it. That's the same sensation that I think we still get when we're assessing images at the highest standard, there's something really exhilarating about it in explicable. Uh, but exhilarating.

[00:13:26] I see on the flip side of that, I was laughing with our two work placement students of the other side of the line, which is when you see somebody else take a beautiful photo and they're in the same session as you. Sometimes when I'm training people, this happens to me. And, you know, with talking through staff were doing ideas and then somebody hit the button and they'll create a picture. That I wish. I'd taken and then I have to suppress. I have to suppress that kind of. I'm really jealous about that.

[00:13:54] Why didn't I take that picture? I cause you call and of course you have to celebrate. The absolute, the excitement. I still get the same excitement from the picture. I just wish I'd taken it. Um, Which is quite a weird sensation. I'm getting used to that sensation because if I'm doing my job well in a workshop, I won't do. My job well in a masterclass, if I'm genuinely. Um, passing on ideas and information, then. Really people in those workshops should be creating beautiful images that I'm jealous of. It is still quite hard though.

[00:14:26] Anyway, we were judging it. Click. Um, and I'm going to come back, uh, to, to that in a moment as the topic of this particular podcast. Uh, but a few bits and pieces. Uh, one of the things that occurred to me this morning, and I'm going to drop this into this podcast because it's a useful thing to remember. Um, is always remember to pack your bag so that at a single glance, you know, what's. In it. And will more importantly, what isn't. I was driving along and I do this thing.

[00:14:56] If you. I don't know if you're the same as me. I'll get halfway down the road and I'll be like, did I pack my passport? And I literally, I don't know how many times I've done it. I've pulled into a lay-by and gone and checked. I still do the same with my camera kit. But this morning I was driving away and I did that thing. Have I, I packed everything I need.

[00:15:14] And then actually I remembered I'd looked over the top of my bag. Um, while it was open and I know everything was there because I pack it in a way that if something is missing, I can see the gap. And it's like, oh, okay. So, um, you could do it with checklists. Of course you can be much more methodical than that, but just as a simple trick, pack your bag in a way where you can visibly see if something is missing. Right.

[00:15:39] So where are we in our warm bath water? I still think that's a great review. Thank you, skinny latte. That's just like the skinny lattes. They use it named by the way. That's not just me being random. Uh, that is like the best review. I'm going to put that on a, if I ever have a poster. You know, Paul Wilkinson appearing somewhere. , it's like sitting in a bath of warm water. I don't know what to do with it, but it's, uh, please feel free everybody. To write us poetic reviews like this, and I promise you they will get read out because it's absolute genius.

[00:16:10] Um, I just love that I'm going to have that printed as a poster. I'm loving this podcast is like sitting in a bath of warm water. Anyway. Um, I thought I do these regularly, um, quick updates on things that I heard or saw during um, the judging. Um, So, let me just go over some incidentally as an aside one of the reasons we use, sorry, there's lots of asides with me. You get used to that or you don't. That was funny. The night I met someone for the first time and she laughed at me and said, you're always after the punchline aren't you. And I was like, yeah, that was really. Is very astute, but it did somewhat stop me in my tracks. Um, I don't mean to be like that. I just am a.

[00:16:54] One of the reasons we use a panel of judges are more than one judge. Is so that we get a more reliable score, but I was judging in the monthly's this month round. I. So I wouldn't say who the judge was, but they were very worried that their score was out of kilter with the other judge. And they had no reason to be.

[00:17:14] I, I can export the judges scores and I can see exactly what's going on. Um, I'm a big data, nut, I love data. I love the data behind scoring. So I've had a look at the data and their scoring is exactly where I would hope it would be, but you don't always agree. And that's really important. If every judge for every image gave the same score, we'd only ever need one judge. That's not how it works. That is so not how it works.

[00:17:43] It's not supposed to work like that. A panel of judges are all supposed to bring different experiences. Different backgrounds, different hotspots that they look for different passions, different prejudices, different biases by using a panel of judges. You will always get a different score or you should always get a different score from every judge or you haven't picked your panel of judges very well.

[00:18:09] And we pick up panels of judges incredibly carefully so that they are different. They bring different ideas to the table. We pick the panel of judges so that they're going to get on, they're going to work as a team. So if there's a challenge, if there's a discussion or they're not going to get into an argument, they're going to develop. Uh, thought process, and come to a considered view.

[00:18:28] That's why we use a panel of judges. It's important that the judges are reliable and they are experienced and they're top of their game. Of course. But they will give different scores. Anyway in the, from a Click. At this time and a little bit from the monthly's I thought I very quickly go through one or two things I heard.

[00:18:45] It's just useful stuff. You know, there's nothing major in that.

[00:18:48] Um, so paper choice. Paper choice comes up in every single printer competition I am involved in. Just does. Um, the big one, this time was be careful, where. Um, If you've got a textured paper and you print something like a baby on it with smooth skin, it can look like the baby's skin is wrinkled, particularly when the baby or the face of the baby is quite small in the frame, newborns.

[00:19:12] This was typically a criticism. What's your paper choice. If you're going to. Print things that would have a smooth texture in the real world, smooth skin, that kind of thing. Use a smooth. Paper. Uh, that said if you're using fine art matte, papers, go and figure out how to get your blacks to map correctly because typically fine art matte papers.

[00:19:33] Don't give you much. Uh, changed between the grades of black. It suddenly goes, it goes. Sort of dark. So you get blocked up areas that aren't quite black and then suddenly when it gets to a slightly lighter. Like a lighter tone. You'll start to see texture again. There are ways of printing for that. Go look them up. Uh, Sanjay Jogia, I'm going to give Sanjay quick shout is a brilliant printer. Brilliant technician. Uh, he does, uh, workshops and seminars on printing. You can do a lot worse and go talk to Sanjay. And he's a super lovely guy, too.

[00:20:06] Uh, stray hairs. We had one assay. This was in a digital file, um, in the competition. Uh, this month there's a stray hair in the print in a file. And that's clearly on the sensor. With print and competition judging. The judges are gonna zoom these things in. They're going to look at them under a light on a light box. If it's a print, they're going to zoom it to a hundred percent on a big Eizo monitor if it's a digital competition. If there's a stray hair or a dust spot, they are going to see it. So go find your files, go, go over them and over them and over them.

[00:20:35] If you want to do one in competitions, get the little details, right. Uh, because that score that dropped, I mean, so many points. It was a great image. Great idea, creatively. Brilliant. But if you're letting things like dust spots and stray hairs go through, that's not going to be regarded as competition standard.

[00:20:53] Mounts. We saw some incredible mounts.

[00:20:55] We saw circular mounts and oval mounts and, uh, one photographer. I don't know if it's the same author, but I've seen this technique a couple of times where they cut out the edges of the mounts of the landscape picture goes all the way across and breaks out the sides of the frame.

[00:21:09] Mounting and Presentation Tips

[00:21:09] Um, they're brilliant. Um, you remember that with a print competition?

[00:21:12] Typically the mount is part of the puzzle. So make sure your mounts are complimentary. Make sure they are adding to the image. They're not distracting from the image. Um, make sure that your everything is super accurate, super, just square. It needs to be lined up. We had one. Uh, image where the horizon wasn't horizontal. Uh, it was a seascape. And it wasn't horizontal and it may have slipped in the mound or maybe that the author just didn't notice.

[00:21:40] I don't know which of those two things is true, but of course it's not going to do that. Well, So mounting is really, really important and we do zoom in to make sure the quality. Um, is there.

[00:21:50] Uh, a few dead come up with banding issues, JPEG issues. In this day and age where computers are pretty powerful and you know, the sensors and cameras are at least 14 bit these days. Um, if not 16, Um, then please do just get your techniques down.

[00:22:06] So if you got a big blue sky, make sure it's a big blue sky without banding in it. Um, it's just one of those things.

[00:22:12] The Debate on Titling Images

[00:22:12] Uh, titling. I don't. This comes up every single time. I don't like titling. I don't think it should be necessarily part of an image competition. Um, but I'm out there as I'm in the minority. I think. Um, but I just don't like it. I think we should judge what we see in front of us. But, uh, if the competition asks for a title, enter one, create one, invent one, stick your image in an AI generator and get a title. I don't care how you do it, but put a title in on average. Now I've only heard this anecdotally and I've no idea what the research was, but anecdotally, a couple of judges told me that titles typically give you one additional mark on average, if it's a sensible title. It certainly can add poetry to it. It can add a meaning to it. So if you put a picture. I have no idea. Uh, of, uh, a sad looking child. I don't know, making this up a sad looking child with no title. Well, it's a sad looking child. Put up a sad looking child and give it the title, Daddy's Gone Again. Suddenly, you've got a very different tone to how the view is and the judges. Our assessing an image.

[00:23:23] Now this is why I don't agree with it because I don't think that's how it should work. I think we should judge the image. But given it's an opportunity to get a mark or two. And given you're entering a competition, which is a game. Then play the game. And put titles in.

[00:23:37] Attention to Detail in Photography

[00:23:37] Uh, where are we? Um, a couple of images came up this time round, which I wrote down all details and reading this and we notebook. I carry a note book almost all of the time.

[00:23:46] It's a throwback to my PhD days. I think always had a notebook. Uh, title, sorry. All details. Some so EEG cushions, this was a, an image that came in where the hole that the room had been styled to perfection. But when you looked at the sofa, It looks like. Somebody had just sat on it. So the cushions were fine. Like the back cushions, the throws and all of those, but the actual seated part of the sofa. Had been left as if somebody just sat on it, perhaps sat on it to plump up the cushions. I don't know, but it just, it drew our eye to X. Everything else in the image was so pristine. What's your details, particularly with architectural and commercial.

[00:24:25] Uh, confusion.

[00:24:26] Understanding Image Composition

[00:24:26] This came up. Where we weren't certain or the judges, weren't certain what to make of an image. I've talked about this a few times. It's not the judges, job to decode your story.

[00:24:40] It's your job as the author to tell your story in a way that the judges can get it. It's got to be approachable. Um, you can be as clever as you, like, you can be as subtle as you like, but in the end, if you're not telling the story in a way that the judges can understand decode it, that's not the judge's fault. Um, so just, you know, make sure, maybe test it on other people and see what they think at image before submitting it.

[00:25:04] Uh, we saw a few of these. Uh, what have I written down? Uh, They've written down. Uh, the only image here. Okay. I wrote down if only if only is one of those things. Have you ever done that with your images where you look at an image in Lightroom and you're just like, oh, if only. If only the background was clean. If only I hadn't blown a highlight, if only the eyes were sharp. You know what I mean?

[00:25:29] You have these if only moments where the image you'd done everything. Right. But then you've missed a bit. Well, don't enter those into a competition for a star. Um, There was one image that came up and. It felt to me like. It felt like a grab shot. It was a beautiful shot, but a grab shot. Now the construction of the image was one we see all the time dog in a basket, nothing particularly clever about that. Um, or, you know, rare in that, I suppose.

[00:25:56] But the particular angle, the way it was framed, felt like they grabbed the shot. Now, if you said to a fine oil artist or pencil artist, or a cartoonist or a commercial air brusher, create me a picture of a dog in a basket. They would have a real angle on it. There'd be something about the way they place the objects relative to each other and relative to the frame. There'll be a way of doing it. That would have a certain aesthetic, a style, a cleanliness for me, my particular thing is I love when the lens is absolutely horizontal. Low down in the frame, preferably on the floor. If it's a subject that is on the floor so that everything for me, I feel like it climbs into that world.

[00:26:42] That's just my particular aesthetic. It doesn't have to be anybody else's. I mean, please. Everybody. I'm a Muppet. I don't know what I might have out, but I liked the idea that I've done something that has a, it has a statement to it. It has a shape to it. I love the work of E.H. Shephard who drew A.A. Milne's books, um, Winnie the Pooh and house at Pooh. The corner and when we were young and all of these beautiful Christopher Robin stuff. The drawings always feel like you're in the small characters world. You're not an adult looking down at it.

[00:27:13] And I think that's the point I'm trying to make is have a view. Think about it. Think as if you're drawing it, don't think of it as a photograph thing. Okay. Take a step back. If you've got time. Sometimes you don't right. If you're a news photographer, you haven't got time, but step back from your image in your head. Say, okay, these are all of the bits of the puzzle. This is, I've got one of those, two of them, three of them. I've got these colors and this shape, this light. If I was drawing this, if I slowed down and somebody said, draw those on a piece of paper. So that made sense. How would I do it? Uh, you know, there's an, there's another picture.

[00:27:49] It was a picture. Um, it was a newborn picture. And there were objects in the foreground. So it was, it made it feel like the baby was amongst objects and then objects behind the baby. But what's happened is they've. Thought that because we mutter a lot, and I'll come on to this one later. don't crop things at the edges of a frame. They pulled the objects.

[00:28:11] That baby is surrounded by, away from the edge of the frame, but that meant, it felt like there was only a few objects. In this instance, using the objects and cutting them at the edge of the frame as if there was millions of them receding into the distance that would have made sense. And visually it would have had an expansive feel to it, rather than I only have four of those objects, so I've placed them where I have. And it's that sense of thinking about your layer? And if you look at the very best of these types of images, The guys really do know their way round it.

[00:28:41] Uh, comping compositing. Combining images. It must be invisible. We actually, as photographers, don't have a problem on the whole, unless the category says you can't use composite images. We don't have a problem with it. Judges don't worry about it.

[00:28:55] We just don't want to see it. So the compositing, the bringing different images and elements together has to be invisible. Uh, there are skills to this. Practice them. Because if you, the minute a judge spots that it's a composite, it's failed in its job. I mean, obviously there are obvious composites, you know, if you're doing a. King Kong thing of a gorilla climbing, a skyscraper. Fair enough. We're going to know straight away. That's not real. But it still has to look real, has to be believable. Uh, okay. What else have we got?

[00:29:26] Um, baby skin. This has come up a few times. Be careful of. Using blue and dark green style filters, filter effects in your monochrome conversions. Uh, blue filter typically turns the lips dark, which is fine. If you have, um, You've got a model and smooth skin like ultra smooth skin and makeup that's flawless because you've got red lipstick and you punch them on a Chrome with a bluish or green filter. It drops the lips to a very dark color and that could look incredible. But with babies would it also does. If there's any red in the cheeks, it makes those go blotchy too. So you have dark lips and bruised looking cheeks, and that's not really, how probably you want to have. A baby photograph, by the way, if you can hear stuff going on in the background, I've got all the windows open because it's a really warm day. Um, and I'm sitting just recording. Uh, where are we?

[00:30:23] On the converse side of that. So we've got blue filters, making skin look kind of grungy and textured and blotchy. Equally, we are still seeing way too much over smoothing. Um, on the skin work. Um, it just. It doesn't look, if it doesn't look quite right, you know, and it's really subtle. I don't know how to describe it, but we know as judges, when we look at I I'm a big one for, when someone applies makeup to a face really well, really beautifully. It smooths out the lumps and bumps, but what it doesn't do is remove the texture.

[00:30:59] There's still pores, there's still skin pores there're still fine hairs. There are still little tiny ripples created by blemishes underneath the makeup. So, if you want to make it look real, when you're doing digital makeup or digital smoothing. You have to remember to leave details in that show reality, even when you're doing really fine art kind of work.

[00:31:21] So just what's that. Um, incidentally, a shout again to EVOTO.AI. Um, I've just had a new release of that this week. Um, incredible bit of software. Uh, in that you can control how much you do. So it's not, it's not all the bells and whistles that make these things good. What make these things good is when you can turn it down, so it's imperceptible. Uh, EVOTO.AI is actually very, very good. Please do go and have a play with that. I will drop a link down in. Uh, further down in the show notes.

[00:31:54] The Importance of Image Sharpening

[00:31:54] Over sharpening. Uh, this came up as a bit of a debate actually, me and Sanjay don't entirely agree on this. I don't think. My view is that you don't need to sharpen images anymore. Um, I've never heard, not once have I heard. Uh, judge say this image needed more sharpening. Not once I've heard images get critiqued, cause they're soft by the which, I mean they're blurred. And the minute you try to rescue a blurred image using, um, Topaz or, you know, any one of the sharpening tools. Unless you're really on top of it and really, really, really careful, it looks like it's sharpened. However, I've heard many times. That an image looks over sharpened over, over you see halos, you see this kind of slightly, really weird edge effect. Um, I took the decision a couple of years ago to stop sharpening my images, because it removes one or two problems when you. Because for us, we don't, uh, we produce the same file to be printed at different sizes.

[00:32:49] I don't worry too much. Um, about, uh, scaling at 300 DPI for A4, 300 DPI for seven by five, three to DPI. I just give the guys one file. Um, and our sensors now is so sharp that they reproduce and they give a, for me, they give a slightly smoother finish. Um, And I've only ever been pulled upon over sharpening when I did it.

[00:33:11] No one's ever pulled me up on under sharpening. So I would say don't sharpen Sanjay. Doesn't say that he says you should do sharpening, but know exactly at which point in the workflow to do it. And that's fine. Um, Sanjay is a master at this stuff. So he does sharpen. Uh, I'm using Sanjay as an example because he's one of my judges, uh, this time round. Uh, so is there an interesting thing. My, if you're not absolutely a hundred percent certain of what sharpening to do, don't do any, you'll be fine.

[00:33:40] Uh, where are we?

[00:33:42] Final Thoughts and Recommendations

[00:33:42] Um, oh yeah, one of the things. It has come up this come up in conversation a little bit is why we as judges get so picky about which images get over the line to be a merit or a bronze. So typically with all of the associations all slightly different. But around about the 80 mark for most associations is the break point for bronze or merit. Now. The thing about a bronze or a merit is that is something that's likely to end up being used on a website or being used in social media for the association. Um, maybe with the societies, it's going to end up on their display boards at the convention.

[00:34:23] And that's why we're picky. That break point between professional standard is a lot, the associations call it and a merit or bronze. That break point defines what will be displayed to the public and to the rest of the photography industry. And as such the message we're sending is that this image is what you should be trying to attain. So when I go round, if I'm, uh, if I've entered a competition, I go round and look at all of the things that have. Uh, they're being displayed in the convention or they're in the magazine or in a book.

[00:34:55] I look at those images from bronze to gold. As the things I should be aiming for. And that's why as judges, we're very careful what goes over that line. And if we find a defect that we think, do you know what the photographer should have spotted that. You're going to dump marks really quickly because the judges don't want to have that out there as something that becomes an exemplar for what a successful image should be.

[00:35:16] That's why. That's why that break point is so tough. Uh, so just what you, it was quite funny, this in the competition this time round. Uh, and the monthly's is, uh, one of the images looked like the horizon. Wasn't quite level, it's a digital file. So it clearly wasn't anything to do the mounting. And by the way, it was a degree or two out, which is. I don't know. I don't know why people do that. Why would you do that? Given you just put into Lightroom or Photoshop and align with the ruler to it anyway, my two judges, I'm watching both of them on, uh, our Squadcast screen. So we record these sessions. Um, One of the judges went to his EITZO monitor took the file, put it into Photoshop and checked the horizontal alignment.

[00:35:57] My other judge went to a cupboard. I watched them do it, went to a cupboard behind them, opened the cupboard door, got a ruler. And started measuring her screen, which is quite weird when you're watching it on the webcam that's on her screen. She's measuring the screen. It was quite old school, but it did make me laugh.

[00:36:13] Anyway, things like horizons, check them.

[00:36:16] Uh, Great. Well, so if we got, oh yeah, when you're, there's a lot of actions around and even I've written a few where you're going to soften or blur the edges. Um, So there was a particular file. Where I think a baby skin had been softened. You could see that it had been, and it was fine.

[00:36:36] It looked very good actually it looked like they got a good technique on it. But what they hadn't done is lift all of the skin onto a new layer, just cut it out and drag it onto a new layer and softened it there, what they done is soften it on the original layer with all of the. Um, blankets and clothing around it. And what that did is, it dragged color from the blankets into the soften skin. So you could see a slight coloration around the edges where the softening had been done. And you expect that if you're using a blur. It blurs across the boundary. So what you have to do is cut out the skin onto a new layer. So it's transparent all the way around except for the skin, soften it there, and then you can drop it back in and you'll get no color contamination. Um, but we spotted it and of course it's a real shame.

[00:37:19] Uh, With babies and with faces, the light, the light source should always be above the nose.

[00:37:25] I heard this said a few times by different, uh, I think I was working with Elli Cassidy who is just like one of the best judges to work with, she's lovely. Super lovely, super nice person. Um, great newborn photographer and she raised the same point as did lots of others. The light source should be above the nose, nine times out of 10. It's very rare. Do you want the light coming up from underneath?

[00:37:44] Um, I love this quote. This is one of my judges. He just, he liked a particular image because it was a bit more different. If ever I have another podcast in this industry, I'm going to call it The Bit More Different Podcast because I know it's a great title.

[00:37:57] It's not English, but it's a great title.

[00:37:59] Um, final bit on this bit. Is cropping at the edges. We can't, I kind of talked about it a minute ago with the baby and the objects. Just look around the edges of the frame. There's an amazing news image, this time round. Loved it. I'm not going to say what it was cause I'm not gonna draw attention for the author. But there was a scene in the middle of his action in the middle.

[00:38:23] And on the right-hand side of the frame, there was nothing contaminating. Everything was kind of contained, but on the left. They were knuckles and elbows poking in onto the edge of the file when just moving the crop edge in by. I dunno, a couple of hundred pixels on a six megapixel file would have removed all of that, and focused, directly on the story in the middle. And it's such a silly thing.

[00:38:47] We see it all the time. Is we get sidetracked by what's going on in the middle of our picture, the bit we want people to look at it and we forget to look. All the way around the edges of the frame. I look around the edges of your frame carefully. And if there's anything there that's distracting and pulling your eye away. Just change your crop or clone them out, whichever is easy for you.

[00:39:08] Um, So that's it. Those are the notes. I mean, there's loads, of course there's loads of things. I carry copious notes, but I thought those are the most interesting. Um, to talk about, uh, particularly as we're, heading towards, uh, at this time of year, when people start to hive images away ready for the competitions, uh, for the BIPP print competition. Um, and eventually, you know, the doors will open for the society's convention as well.

[00:39:30] So I thought there'd be useful. Um, The other thing, a couple of updates. Where are we with things that I've been asked? Uh, to look at. Uh, where are we? DXE DXE. CXO asked me to play with. DXA labs. Uh, the DXA labs for, I think it is an, a DX oh, film pack seven. Now the XO labs. It's not really the photo lab is not really for me because it, Lightroom is at the heart of my workflow. Um, we used the XO pure raw anyway, which is brilliant, pure, or for, by the way. Brilliant.

[00:40:03] Absolutely love it. Uh, so don't, for me, that's not necessarily something I'm going to put into my workflow. I'm sure it's very good. I've used it a little bit, but however, the DSO film pack, film pack seven. It's an absolute blast. Loving it just for the moment.

[00:40:17] I use effects quite a lot, but I like it if I can for it not to look effected. If you see what I mean that of course, the minute you really easily apply a film preset, of course he looks effected, I'm not an idiot. Um, but I love those kinds of tones. They feel very analog to me. Uh, it's really, uh, really, really, really good.

[00:40:34] So, uh, highly recommends if you get a chance to have a play with that. I'm sure they do a trial. I haven't looked. Uh, DXO Filmpack 7. And the other thing I thought I'd give a quick shout about today. Um, his ACDSee, which I've continued to use again, they approached me and asked me to have a look at it and say what I thought it's really, really good.

[00:40:55] Um, it's not good at high volumes of face recognition. I discovered that as it. just crashed my computer basically. Um, but that not withstanding. It's blindingly quick is great to have it there . Lightroom for us is our management tool for all of our raw files. Um, but the RAW files get archived away, and we then have all of the JPEGs that I've generated for print. Hi res. Uh, low compression JPEGs.

[00:41:21] So having ACDSee that looks over all of my Dropbox folders and keeps that as an active catalog. Is great because I can get to any image. I like, in a heartbeat. Absolutely brilliant. So I absolutely, I would highly recommend that. Um, again, I will put a link to, um, I'll put a link to ACDSee in the show notes. And then finally just a more pop-up it's our beer festival on Saturday.

[00:41:45] Now. I know none of you are local, but nonetheless, um, I will be at the beer festival if anyone fancies a beer and a chat we're in, but it had them in Buckingham share. Uh, I'd love to catch up if there is anybody around, because it's, I'm hoping that there's going to be good. Um, it's like the best place to listen to music.

[00:42:02] Have a nice beer. And have a great conversation. And on that happy note, I'm going to go home now and we're going to open. I hope a bottle of champagne to celebrate Jake's success and Harriet's success in her new job. Uh, the sun is shining. And then we're going to try and stay up and see the results. Of this particular, general election.

[00:42:21] Again, to all our American friends have a wonderful . Uh, July 4th.

[00:42:25] And I'm going to go away and be more like sitting in a bath of warm water. I remember whatever else. Be kind to yourself. Take care.

There are many factors to success and I have listed many in these podcasts, but the brutal reality is that it takes hard work.  Lots of it.  There isn't a silver bullet, no matter what every influencer, marketer, salesman, advertorial or Facebook campaign might try to convince you - and AI ain't gonna fix it either.  All I wish is that I could stop seeing the ads that tell me otherwise!

Before all that, though, I head up the episode with a quick chat with Colin Jones, CEO of The Societies Of Photographers. This is one more in my series of interviews-from-the-photography-show (I need a snappier title) and it's interesting that once more, training and education are at the forefront of his thoughts.

Also, I mention a brilliant app called EVOTO.AI in this episode.  At some point I'll do a deep-dive into it but rest-assured, this is well worth exploring if, like me, you create portraits for a living.  The guys have kindly given me a link you can use that gives you thirty free credits when you register: https://go.evoto.ai/PaulWilkinson One great thing about this app is that you only burn a credit up when export a finished image - you can test it out on as many as you like.  This means those thirty credits could be enough for you to play around with as many images as you want until you're happy and then go ahead and run an entire portrait session through!  

Let me know what you think!

Cheers
P.

---

If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

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If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

Transcript

EP153 It Takes Work And Life Would Be Boring Without Sarah

Introduction to Colin Jones

[00:00:00] I'm Colin Jones. I'm the CEO for the Society of Photographers. Excellent. It's lovely to see you as always, Colin.

The Photography Show Experience

[00:00:06] Tell me why you come to the photography show. Oh, the photography show is a great show. It's great to meet up with all the trade, seeing all the latest products and services in the industry and getting to network with other photographers.

[00:00:17] It's a great show to come to.

Passion for Photography

[00:00:18] So, tell me why you love this industry so much.

[00:00:21] Oh, I love the industry. I've always been part of the photography industry. It's been part of my family since my granddad and my dad, and it's an industry full of amazing people, creative people, uh, and, you know, so much passion for, for, for photography and for the craft of it.

[00:00:35] And I love seeing people excel in the industry as well.

[00:00:37] So that's all of the positives.

Industry Improvements

[00:00:38] But if, like everything, there was always things we could do better as an industry. If there's one thing, just one thing that you could change in this glorious passion of ours, what would it be?

[00:00:48] I think I'd like to see photographers get more training, invest more time in training and more, more money in training. Uh, you know, I see, when we see people take that step and really invest in training to push not only their photography but their business, we see so much success. Uh, so I'd love to see training be more, , forefront of the industry.

Importance of Training

[00:01:04] When you're talking about training, what aspects do you think, photographers in the industry, certainly the industry we spend most of our time with, which is the UK industry, what do you think is the weak spot? Which direction do you think the development would be most applicable.

[00:01:19] I think, uh, quite a lot of photographers, if they're in business, uh, that's where we see a lot of photographers really struggle getting clients through the door, marketing their services, uh, so that's, that's always been a big passion of mine, is getting photographers more training in the business side, but, you know, I, I genuinely think training of any kind, whether it's lighting and posing, or even just networking with your peers, uh, and getting training that way, just by talking to other photographers, uh, is a, is a real bonus.

[00:01:43] Excellent.

Interview Conclusion

[00:01:43] Perfect answers, as always, from one of the nicest guys in the industry. Thank you, Colin.

[00:01:47] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Uh, so that is one more of those little interviews I did at the photography show earlier this year. That was Colin Jones, the CEO of the Societies Of, Photographers. It's always interesting talking to people like Colin. I mean, not just because he's a really lovely guy. But he hears from hundreds, possibly thousands of photographers, uh, on a scale that most of us can only imagine.

[00:02:11] And yet the themes still seem to be consistent.

[00:02:15] It's all about education.

Podcast Introduction

[00:02:17] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: And learning I'm Paul and this is the masteringportraitphotography.com podcast.

[00:02:22]

[00:02:36] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Well, it's been three weeks since the last episode and yesterday, yesterday.

Wedding Anniversary Anecdote

[00:02:45] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: It was mine and Sarah's 21st wedding anniversary. She sent me a card and it simply said, imagine how boring life would be without me. Literally in quotes. Imagine how boring life would be without me. Well, this morning, She bit my toe, I was fast asleep. She bit my toe now I sleep with my feet. Out of the bottom of the duvet.

[00:03:09] I've always done it. And I've no idea why, but I do. This morning. She bit my toe. And this isn't really a unique event. I think she probably does it a few times. A year I am asleep, then rudely I'm awakened. With pain. There is nothing in between those two moments except a searing sensation that someone has sunk their teeth. Into my big toe. I don't really know which bit hurts the most, the initial bite or the moments I react and pull away leaving tooth marks. This morning. She bit my toe.

[00:03:46] It's true. Sarah is right. Imagine how life would be without her. Imagine how boring. It would be, frankly, I can't imagine it. I can't picture. How things would be without every morning. They're being the risk that she's going to sink her teeth into my toe. But Sarah is the person who makes me laugh the most.

[00:04:07] She is the person who allows the extrovert in me out. She's the person who props me up when I'm down. And she's the person who keeps a lid on me. When I'm up. That sounds really weird, but you get the gist of it. Um, you know, I can be quite full on, I think, and it, Sarah, that just keeps things nice and steady.

[00:04:28] And so thank you Sarah, for 21 years of marriage, 33 years of hilarity between the two of us. So, yes, life would be really boring without her.

[00:04:41] Anyway, in the past three weeks, what has happened in our diary.

Recent Portrait Sessions

[00:04:46] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Well there have been 22 different portrait sessions, which is lovely, including one, uh, just this morning, beautiful family. Uh, so a mom with her two children and her two grandchildren. Um, just lovely out in the sunshine, a quick drive over to their house. Shot in the garden.

[00:05:05] What was funny about it was every single shot. She wanted her front door in the images. Which, uh, I've had sort of, you know, big Manor houses and different things about to be part of a shoot, but I've never had one where the front door has to be prominent, but it was a joyous shoot, beautiful people.

[00:05:23] They made me very welcome.

[00:05:24] Cannot wait to show them their pictures. And one of the two little girls -she's three years old -was wearing a Liverpool FC football strip. Now on two levels that just filled my heart, with joy. On the one level. It's Liverpool, which happens to be the team that I also have always supported all my life I've supported.

[00:05:46] And when I say supported, what I mean is occasionally I've looked at their headlines and seen the score. Or occasionally, you know, a key match comes up and I might watch the first 20 minutes of it, before it gets way too stressful for me, and I leave the room. I'm not really a supporter in the supporter sense of the word. But if I'm ever, if ever I'm asked, and this is since I've been about five years old, it's been Liverpool. And she was wearing a kit this morning and the kit was almost identical to a kit I was bought for Christmas when I think I was about eight. There's something about the styling of the current, the current kit, the red with the white collar. The cut of it, the styling of it, that's almost exactly the same as it was all of those years ago when it was Kevin Keegan and the boys playing. And so that made me happy.

[00:06:36] The main reason, it made me really happy. Is isn't it amazing. Oh, is it amazing or isn't it about time?

[00:06:43] Maybe it's about time. Maybe we're just getting there. That a girl turned up at the door. She's three years old and she's a football fanatic. And I know now the way it will be for her is so very different, than for instance, if my sister, when she was that age wanted to play football. Now my, my sister, cause I was a drummer, my sister wanted to play drums, but the girl's school, she went to said that wasn't lady like. How heartbreaking is that? I know we're going back quite a long time, but how heartbreaking. Is that, that you can't do something. Because it's not lady like. You can't do something because because of your gender, it doesn't fit in. It's just ridiculous.

[00:07:25] And so it is so heartwarming this morning. To see this little girl in bright red, bright red Liverpool football strip, kicking a ball around the garden and loving every single second of it. And unlike my sister, where I think life in that particular time. In the late eighties, early nineties. You know, Society's, it was sort of prevented things like that. I know this little kid that won't be the case. For her, at least. I trust it won't be the case for her.

Hearing Dogs Shoots

[00:07:57] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: So wonderful shoot this morning, 22 portraits shoots over the past three weeks, we'd done five Hearing Dogs shoots. Uh, two of those have been out on a location and they've been so joyous, so profoundly joyous. Um, the one yesterday was of one of our recipients whose Hearing Dog has essentially. Been a lifesaver.

[00:08:18] I mean, I, I hear this quite a lot, but I really do think, uh, the lady I photographed with her dog yesterday, she's in her mid twenties. Um, Is just, was just an inspiration, really the relationship with the dog, the way they were, the joy that dog has brought, um, And it was just a magical shoot. And one of the things about these all, I mean, all portrait shoots, I think, but in particular with shoots like the Hearing Dogs is as much as I'm providing a service, as much as I'm providing images that they can use for fundraising and publicity and PR and marketing and all of these things. Is, they provide me with a sense of, what's the right word, they energize me. They give me energy and positivity. I come away from these shoots so much more full of life than I do when I arrive at them. I just think. It's just incredible. The joy that a photography can bring, not just to the people I'm photographing, but also, uh, to me.

[00:09:22] Uh, we've had five cleanse that was a bit abrupt, sorry about that. I don't know. I maybe I just couldn't think of a good point to wind up on, but being a portrait photographer is a thing of joy.

[00:09:33] It is a thing of life is a thing of positivity and energy. Um, and I suppose that's what I'm trying to get to. It really is something, but it's not a one way street. I get as much energy and joy out of these shoots as my client's do.

Client Reveals and Workshops

[00:09:48] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Uh, we've also had five client reveals. Uh, just wonderful. I love it when the clients come to see that images, we never quite certain what we're going to sell. But, uh, it's just a lovely thing to see the reaction to people when they see their pictures sometimes surprise. In fact, nearly, always surprise at how beautiful the pictures can be, I don't know why they're surprised they've come to us. They've come to us because they've seen what I can do for others. Um, and yet still the surprise very often it's clients who've been to us before, and they're still surprised. Maybe I should work harder at explaining what we, what we do, but that element of surprise. It's a lovely thing when it's done in the, in the reveal room and tomorrow we've got a little wedding, it was just a two person wedding uh, who are coming to see their pictures. And again, massively looking forward to that. Uh, we've run one one-on-one masterclass.

[00:10:37] I love the one-on-one masterclasses. Because of course, every topic, every topic can be on the table. We don't need to worry about. Uh, suiting or fulfilling the requirements of four or five people. It's just one person and we can play, we can talk, uh, we can jump between different topics. We can try different things out depending on their needs.

[00:10:57] Anything from business all the way through to how to prep your files for Photoshop. It doesn't really make any difference to us. And so for that, it's just a wonderful thing to do.

[00:11:07] We've also done a, an off-camera flash workshop. Now the off-camera flash workshops are by far the hardest. Even this morning, a little shoot. Um, when I met bumped into the little girl, Uh, in her Liverpool outfit, Liverpool kit. I decided one of the shots we would do would be, uh, like a FIFA or UEFA. Uh, footballer's pose because all footballers are contracted to do these things so that when, uh, the, the, the TV companies roll out or, or show the team list or whatever, or feature a player, there's footage of every player walking into shot and standing a very particular way, they lit a very particular way. Um, and you can do that quite happily out in the garden with some off-camera flash.

[00:11:50] So even this morning I was using. Off camera flash, and you have to sort of pause a little bit and think, okay. And you, you have to build the shot setting by setting. Then it's not as straightforward as it is just using TTL. You could just use TTL on your flash guns. Uh, but you get sort of slightly erratic results if you do that. You have to understand how, uh, the shutter speed, the aperture, the ISO, they all interact to give you the output you're looking for. And this morning absolutely nailed it. But when you're trying to teach it, trying to get those principles across in a way that is clear, a way that is concise and a way that is repeatable so that you will delegates can leave. And use that, those techniques themselves. Isn't trivial.

[00:12:41] It's the, of all the things we teach here at the studio, I think. It's the hardest. And I know it's the hardest because when I'm suddenly faced with having to get the settings right for myself on a shoot, invariably I'll change the wrong thing at the wrong moment. And it's like, oh, bugger. bugger Having to go back. And figure it out. Uh, so it was, it was lovely to do a brilliant day, lots of laughter and one that Sarah was away for.

[00:13:07] So thank you to Katie and James who stepped in. And Katie stepped into the role of, of Sarah, because she had to go and look after my in-laws new puppy for eight days, honestly, she's come back exhausted that, that Sarah, that is not the puppy. Uh, she's come back. Absolutely exhausted. The puppy goes to sleep at midnight. The puppy wakes up at six and there's very little in between. It's on and off. Uh, and it's on from 6:00 AM to midnight and it's off from midnight til six. She was absolutely shattered. So, uh, she was away the week when we running the workshop, unfortunately. And it couldn't be helped, not a lot of sidestepping, but Katie, thank you very much for stepping in. And being sort of a surrogate, Sarah and helping me make sure that everything ran. Uh, smoothly.

BIPP Qualifications Judging

[00:13:53] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Uh, also this last week we have done a full day of qualifications judging for the BIPP, the British Institute of Professional Photography. Um, It's a wonderful thing. Qualifications are such an amazing thing to be a part of. And I mean, that from both sides of the line.

[00:14:12] I kind of draw inspiration from the candidates, the people putting their images in for assessment and I draw inspiration from the judges, but in very different ways.

[00:14:24] The candidates, of course. It takes quite a lot of bravery, I think, to submit your images. I mean, we've all been through it, but it still is quite a thing to do. To submit your images in for assessment as qualification, because you don't know, you don't truly know, even the mentors don't truly know, whether a panel is going to be successful or not.

[00:14:45] , we did eight panels in a day. I'm chairing it.

[00:14:48] So I'm not really a judge in that sense anymore. I chair it and make sure it's run smoothly And the process is meticulous in the way we do it, so that it's fair and equitable for every single candidate.

[00:15:03] Firstly, the candidate sets up their panel and the judges, get to assess the images. At the end of that first assessment , we take a vote. Then have a discussion and then we take a second vote. And the reason we do it like that is so that the judges get to make up their minds independently with no influence. They're just assessing the images on their own. And on an individual basis. Then we vote. And then as a discussion and in that discussion, It's about the judging team, the panel of judges arriving at a decision that is, a combination of their own independent view and the views of the other four judges. And it's important that it's done like that because every judge has a different experience, different influences and skills for how they assess the images.

[00:15:53] And so when the judges talk, each judge gets the opportunity to address the panel, and talk about why they think their decision is the right one. But they're also listening to the other four judges and taking into account, maybe things they haven't noticed or maybe things that they just don't prioritize quite the same way.

[00:16:17] And listening to these six judges or five at a time, but the six judges in discourse, listening, giving their views, knowing when to be brave and when to stand their ground, but also know when to flex, and acknowledge that may be another photographer, another judge has more experience in an area or a spotted, something that they haven't, that that was exhilarating in the extreme, because the panel of judges each time there was a discussion , they came to decision and the whole panel doesn't have to be unanimous, but the whole panel of judges respects and understands the outcome of the process.

[00:16:56] Now, of course the delegate might not. That is other candidate rather than might not. That is true. And it wasn't a hundred percent pass, uh, in terms of each of the panels. And it's always heartbreaking. I wish the candidates could see behind the curtain while we come to the decision. That's not part of the process that we've opened up just yet. Um, that may come in the future as we get our arms around a way of doing that, that is. Uh, fair. But genuinely when a panel was unsuccessful, you could almost hear everybody in the room, you can almost hear their hearts. Breaking.

[00:17:37] When we say, we're sorry. We mean it. Because we would love every single panel to be a successful panel. We would love that. But in the end. It's a, it's a balancing act between making sure that we reward the endeavor, we reward the work. But the standards have to be high. They have to be. Consistent. They have to be something that when people look at the letters you put on the wall. They mean something and sadly they can only mean something.

[00:18:12] If we hold our ground, on, uh, the standards, the process, and the reasons why certain panels will succeed where other panels may not make it this particular time, but what an absolute what an absolute privilege to be in the room with those judges, looking at those panels, the panels were stunning. Even the ones that were unsuccessful this time round, the panels were stunning.

[00:18:34] So a huge, thank you. To the six judges who came and provided their skills, their eyes, their experience to, assess each of the candidates work

[00:18:47] And what a beautiful thing to be a part of.

[00:18:50] Um, what else? What have I written in my notes?

Personal Reflections and Future Plans

[00:18:52] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: So, yeah, I've drank a little too much this week and exercised a little too little. That's something I'm now feeling very guilty about. And this afternoon, it's Saturday afternoon. And I sat and thought. Shall I go home and get on the exercise, bike or shall I record a podcast.

[00:19:06] And I thought, oh, I better record this podcast, but trust me when this is recorded. I'm going to go home and do a little bit more exercise than I have this week. This week I've barely slept. I've been working in London. I've been working in Essex. I've been working here locally. This stuff has got to go out.

[00:19:23] I've written an article for professional photo magazine, big shout out to those guys, by the way, the online magazine looks fantastic that's Professional. Uh, Photo Magazine. Uh, but what, uh, what a week it has been,

[00:19:36] uh, final note, . Final note this week. Um, it's been a real run of it just at the moment in that.

Product Reviews and Recommendations

[00:19:43] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Lots of photographic suppliers have been approaching us to feature their product on either the podcast or masteringportraitphotography.com, or just getting it into our hands so that we can talk about it. And I have a really strict policy here, um, that I'll only talk about things and promote things that I use that are part of our business, part of our workflow, because if they are worth talking about, then trust me. I've already had a look I'm already using it.

[00:20:11] So this one has, this came in yesterday. Um, and I'll put the link in the show notes. We use a bit of software, or we've been exploring a bit of software called EVOTO - E V O T O, which is it's an AI retouching package.

[00:20:27] Now I know I can feel a few of you are hackles going up and bloomin' AI. retouching automated and all of those things. Why do I like it? Well, I like it because you have total control. So in the same way that we use actions in Photoshop, we put up, um, check layers. And do dodging and burning. This takes some of that drudgery out.

[00:20:50] I say, drudgery that, sorry, that sounds dreadful. I don't mean it to sound like that because actually I love retouching.

Balancing Business and Creativity

[00:20:56] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: I love it when I've got an hour. And a beautiful picture that I can just work up, but my business model, doesn't allow me to do that for 22 portrait shoots in three weeks. It just doesn't.

[00:21:08] Now I could outsource it, I suppose. But I've never been really that happy with the results when I've done that. I find, I find things, come back, just looking a little bit plastic. Um, of course I could pay really high-end retouches, but I work in social photography, not commercial retouching. Obviously, if it's going to be the cover of Vogue, I can spend thousands on a single image being retouched, but that's not my world.

[00:21:31] My world is a very solid, very dynamic, very successful social photography. Uh, outfit and. Although I like the images to have a really high fashion look for an awful lot of my work, trying to find techniques to do that quickly is not straightforward.

Discovering EVOTO: A Game-Changer for Retouching

[00:21:48] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Um, so when EVOTO suddenly emerged a few months ago, it's still sort of in beta, at least a lot of the functions are. Um, it's E V O T O you can go download it.

[00:21:59] Um, this particular piece of software allows you a huge amount of control and there are two. Uh, bits of Photoshopping that I really don't enjoy. I don't mind. I love I say. I don't mind. I love skin retouching. I love working at the colors. I love all of that side of it. I really don't like fixing crosshairs, and I don't like fixing creased clothes.

[00:22:21] So there's a two things there, there are others, but those are two things I really just find irritating for whatever reason.

EVOTO Features and Benefits

[00:22:28] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Well, EVOTO on its own, it would be worth the effort of just fixing those, um, it does crosshairs brilliantly and it will take the majority of creases out of pretty much any type of clothing.

[00:22:41] And even if that was all it did, that would be worth the money, but it does so much more. It helps me in so many ways. It's helping us automate and create a higher finish. But it's still looking natural, still looking like they, the images haven't been retouched, I'll do a deep dive into it at some point. Uh, but the guys have been in touch, and I do have a promo code. Uh, if you fancy it again. Uh, put that in the notes, but it's https://go.evoto.ai/PaulWilkinson capital P capital w all one word, Paul Wilkinson. And if you go there and sign up. Uh, you will get 30 free credits, which allow you to have a play.

[00:23:28] So you'll get 30 free credits. The other thing about the software, which I really like is that you pay to finish the image so you can load it up with as many images as you like and run your, your settings on it and run. Basically all of that, the whole of the software. But you only get charged when you export the finished images out.

[00:23:50] Now it's not perfect yet. Uh, only works on certain types of files. It won't work on PSD files. It works on TIFs or RAW files. Uh, or JPEGs, but trust me, it's an absolute godsend. Uh, particularly if you don't overuse it, if you just keep on the right side of the line. The images look natural, they look polished. They look finished. That you've got no crosshairs and even the clothes can get a little bit of an iron. So I'll put that link in the show notes. And if you follow the link, you will get, uh, 30 free credits. By the way, I get no kickback on this. I'm getting nothing out of it. It's just, I talked to the guys. Because I use the software. And I said I would happily, uh, promote it because I think it's, it's absolutely. Uh, brilliant.

[00:24:37] And then anybody, the whole point of this podcast is to make life a little bit easier for anybody, uh, doing portrait. Uh, photography.

Navigating the Photography Business Landscape

[00:24:44] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: So anyway, on to what is, I suppose, as much as it ever is the topic of a podcast, these are just, you know, It's the diary of a working pro in stuff that occurs to me as we, as I get all my life. Um, but here's the primary topic of this particular. Uh, podcast and in a sense. It's a little bit of a moan. I just, I don't like to moan.

[00:25:07] It's not my style, but this is just a little bit of a protest protest. Sounds better than moan. Maybe. A little bit of a protest.

Evaluating Business Advice and Authenticity

[00:25:15] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Which is the sheer number of adverts I get in all of my social feeds with people telling me they have the answer. They can make my photography business successful. They can find me thousands of clients.

[00:25:29] They have a six-figure photographic business. They can tell me how they did it. No one, no one has the answer. It's all lots of small parts. And when I'm looking for help, I look basically for three. Three things more or less. And these. These are three things that it would have to have if I'm going to use someone for some help.

[00:25:48] Firstly, do I admire their pictures? Do I admire their pictures? Do I want or understand why they create what they do? Is it something. That's in tune. With me and what I want.

[00:26:01] A couple of people have come into our studio and said, well, you could do it like this, you could turn the whole space into two working studios, have two photographers in each run, eight shoots. Uh, in each, uh, part of your space per day, that's 16 shoots. Per day, you need to get a sales team onto the calls, do cold calling to lead generation, and you could run a multi-million pound business. Well, I could. But I don't want to. Because those photos are not the photos that I want to take. Um, and besides I want to take them, I love creating pictures. That's part of why we do this. The idea of not creating pictures anymore is not part of my business plan. What I've got to always figure out is how to make this business as profitable as I can, given the caveat, I left a very well-paid job in the city to do it. I left a career and a life of money and shares and shareholder value, and watching stock markets and being a partner in a firm.

[00:26:56] I left all of that behind me because it wasn't, what I wanted. What I wanted to do was create beautiful images and make life just a little bit better for people myself included. Um, so that the idea of doing that, so. I will only ever look for someone who's creating pictures. I truly admire.

[00:27:12] Secondly, , does that business, the business they're describing, does it look like my business vision?

[00:27:18] So whatever it is, they're trying to sell me. Is that part of my vision.

[00:27:23] And thirdly, do I like the person who purports to give me that information.

[00:27:29] If those three things are true, there may be, I'll dig into it a little bit further, but if any, one of those isn't true. I'm not going there. And I get so many ads with people, waving their camera around, telling me some number or rather. You know, I don't know.

[00:27:43] I've created a six figure business in three weeks. Um, I did it all from the comfort of my own home. I mean, there's even ads. Now I get the, tell me they don't need a photographer. You can set up. A headshot business without ever using a photographer. And if I get one more of those ads from someone who clearly doesn't understand. What. Personal branding really is it's the clue is in the title, personal. It's not AI generated.

[00:28:09] I know you can change hairdos and suits. And I use AI everywhere. Trust me. But there's a big difference in the, if you think about the one word you have to have in personal branding, authenticity is at the heart of it. An AI can't give you that. I mean, you can't synthesize authenticity. There's no such thing. Synthetic authenticity is an oxymoron, it is not a thing it's either authentic or ain't. So, uh, I'm sort of very. They're very cynical about those things and they, and these people are always waving a camera around at me, sometimes with the lens cup still on. I assume that it's because the Metta or social media algorithms reward, people waving a camera around.

[00:28:53] So it gets it higher up in my feed and it definitely works as long as it's aimed at me. So I've got hundreds of these things. And they're always, there was a very particular type of person. They're always very bouncy and extrovert and energetic. And I like that. I'm bouncy and energetic and extrovert. Um, but I'd like to know, that their business has been running for 10 years or 15 years.

[00:29:17] I'd like to know. That they consistently do these pictures with real clients, the kind of clients that we find, the kind of clients that are in tune with our business. Um, Now of course, when I dig into them and actually have a hunt around. 99% of them are paper thin. There's nothing underneath there's no, it's not substantiated by any real world. Business acumen or business experience. Some of them will have been successful, but you can feel that they are now going into training because the success of the business has probably beginning to wane.

[00:29:51] I'm looking for a long-term sustained business. If what I want to run is a longterm sustained business. I'm looking for somebody who can do what I want to do. Um, Now it is true. It is true that you can be a great coach without being a sporting star on your own or vocal coach to rockstars. They're not quite the same thing, being good at something and being able to coach in it. Not quite the same thing as being a star in it.

[00:30:18] I understand that. But I really do want to know that the war stories I'm going to learn from are real, that someone's been out there, someone's done it. That they've walked the walk and ideally are still walking the walk I'd much rather learn from a business than from a trainer. If you get what I mean. I want to go to a consultant . Who's still running up business. They're still learning. They're still evolving. I mean, goodness knows. In the UK, we're about to go into a general election. The dates of that have just been released, and if there's one thing I know about elections and anything sort of like, um, referenda, anything like that. Is the phones, just go that little bit quieter. So no matter what happens up until July the fourth, which is the election date, I know that the market will be ever so slightly suppressed because people don't wake up during election campaigning and think first as they wake up, I need to get some photos. That's just not what happens.

[00:31:16] People wake up and thinks, you know, What's Rishi Sunak said today, or where are we headed with the election or any one of a million other things, but photography just gets down the list a little bit, further. So I know we're about to go into a quiet period and what I want is someone who's been through that knows that's what's coming knows that the little intricacies of running a business over a long period of time are far more than you can do something like this in 42 days, or in just three weeks, you can have this success or with just one camera and one lens and working from home, you can telemarket to a thousand people.

[00:31:49] I don't care about any of that. What I want to know is do they run a business that looks a little bit like mine? And I know that they've been there, seen it, done it and are still doing it. Um, now.

The Importance of Hard Work and Superpowers

[00:32:00] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: A couple of episodes ago, I talked about four things, four things, I think are consistent to successful. Photographers that's energy, optimism, enthusiasm, and confidence.

[00:32:12] I stand by that. They're very much there, but they're not all of it. And I did say that in a podcast, they're just the foundation stones. That, not the whole building there. The bit. They're the bedrock or the foundation, everything can be built on, but they are not. The whole building, maybe I'll get over the coming months to talk about each of the different areas that I think you probably need to get to map it out.

[00:32:35] Maybe that'd be a good idea. if I draw it all out. Uh, maybe actually create a little bit, maybe I should stand in front of a camera and wave my camera around with my lens cap on and say, I've got the answer for you. I don't, I don't have the answer. I've just spotted some things that are consistent with people who are successful, energy, optimism, enthusiasm, and confidence. But you'll also need some other stuff.

[00:32:58] And one of them is just hard work over a period of time. Call it, practice. Call it graft, call it wherever you want. It's doing it over a long period of time so that you have your chops down. You graft at it. You'll get some breaks. You'll miss some breaks. You'll have a bit of good luck, you know, have a little bit of bad luck. That's life. There isn't a silver bullet for this, and you really do need to plow through it. So these little ads that come up and say, I've got the answer for you in the next three weeks, you can do this. Um, then just, I'm just doubtful.

[00:33:32] I certainly don't buy into them. And every time I have sort of investigated, they've come up short now we all have superpowers. We do. But we don't all have the same superpowers and there's no one superpower you need, you need a suite of them. But you can't have everything. It's just not possible to be good at everything. Um, my superpowers, I suppose, are I am a grafter I work hard. I can read light. I love, I love technology. I know it's slightly ironic that I'm muttering about some of the AI stuff given I've got a PhD in AI. I adore technology. And I get on with people. Well, mostly I get on with people. But I am not for instance, an avant-garde creative photographer. I'm not edgy. I'm not a visionary. I'm certainly not a master, of marketing or a sales.

[00:34:22] I'm non of those things, but I work hard. At it, I love doing it. And so I do a lot of it. And I particularly love being amongst people. And I love being amongst people when I've got a camera. And if I'm, I suppose I, if I think about it, I can create a portrait. In almost any light. If I can see it. Well, probably I can use it. Those are my superpowers, but everyone will have different superpowers. Some of you will be amazing at business. Some of us will be amazing at marketing and sales. Some of us will be amazing photo shoppers. And fine artists things that I'm not. Um, but that's my superpower. Those are my superpowers. Uh, I'm a grafter can read light love tech and I get on well with people.

[00:35:07] But even then in and of itself. that's not enough. It's a damn good start, but it's not enough. I've got to learn and I have learned as much as I can about everything else. I'm still learning. I'm still on that journey. We're still running. Uh, business that I've learned how to do it alongside Sarah. Sarah. and myself, we've worked out how to do it.

[00:35:27] We've had a corporate background. So we were exposed to the fundamental principles of running businesses, which is really useful. But I've learnt how to run our little business, how to sell. We've learned how to sell stuff. We've learned how to market, we've learnt how to do those things. Using what I would consider to be natural tools. Um, so using the S the superpowers that we have, the ability to get on well with people, the ability to create a picture, actually, after that, you don't need to do too much on the sales side, a couple of little bits and pieces.

[00:35:55] There are techniques. But for us, we've just lent into our natural talents. Um, of really liking our clients and really enjoying being there with them and really enjoying, creating images of them. Uh, and so that's how we've learned how to run a business and we're still learning.

[00:36:12] But I do wish I could stop receiving ads from people, waving a camera at me telling me that they all 25 years old of them. Are the answer. Well, they may be the answer, but they're not the answer. that I would look for. They can't change my business only I can change my business and I'm very, very picky. About who I take advice from.

Final Thoughts and Farewell

[00:36:37] Paul - Studio Rode Broadcaster V3: Anyway, thank you for listening.

[00:36:39] If you have enjoyed this, please do let us know. Please do leave us a rating on iTunes or wherever it is, you get your podcasts and also please do subscribe. So the minute we publish the next one. Bang. There is. In your in-tray or in your list, on your library, on your latest or on your alerts or wherever it is. That it pings up when you listen to your podcasts, please also head over to mastering portrait photography.com, which is. the spiritual home of this podcast. But also of course includes a ton of stuff all about the love. The passion, the creativity in the business of mastering. Portrait photography. If you're curious about any of the workshops and one-on-one masterclasses that we run, um, where there's a whole suite of them. I go back to the thing I said earlier, though. If you think we're the kind of thing you'd like to do.

[00:37:23] If we creating pictures that you'd like to learn how to do, and if you think actually you'd like to learn it from us. And then please do head over to, uh, paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. And there you will find the, um, Coaching section, but just Google paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk workshops and you will find us.

[00:37:41] So on that happy note, I'm going to go, I think. And have a beer in the sunshine with my wife. And lament the fact that I've got one very sore, big toe. Whatever else you do. Be kind to yourself. Take care.

Sometimes it's just a pleasure to sit back and listen.  This is one of those moments - for me, certainly, but hopefully for you too. 

I had the pleasure of sitting and chatting with two icons of the industry - Sean Conboy and the inimatable nonagenarian, Stuart Clark who is not only still shooting at the age of 97 but is a considerable racontour (you can hear me and Sean laughing in the background throughout!)

Stuart started his career in 1941, so his stories are not only entertaining but are fascinating as they cover every photography development from glass plate through to the state of the art digital wizardry we're facing today.

This interview is worth listening to every one of its 90 or so minutes!

Enjoy!

 

Cheers
P.

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If you enjoy this podcast, please head over to Mastering Portrait Photography, for more articles and videos about this beautiful industry. You can also read a full transcript of this episode.

PLEASE also subscribe and leave us a review - we'd love to hear what you think!

If there are any topics, you would like to hear, have questions we could answer or would like to come and be interviewed on the podcast, please contact me at paul@paulwilkinsonphotography.co.uk. 

 

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Paul: So there are so, so many things I love about being in this industry, the things we get to do, and in particular, this podcast, and one of the many things is having these moments that you're about to hear, where I get to sit and chat with someone I've known for a very long time, Sean Conboy, fantastic photographer, and just a wonderful human being.

[00:00:20] And someone he introduced me to, a guy called Stuart Clark. 

[00:00:23] Now Stuart is 98 years old in July this year. Self proclaimed as one of the oldest working photographers in the country, and I'm not sure that anyone's going to argue with that. He started training as a photographer in 1940. That makes this, he's been working as a photographer for 84 years.

[00:00:46] And the whole of this interview is taking place in what was, his photography studio in a little town just outside Leeds. It's his front living room, but it's huge. It's got a high ceiling and you can imagine how the lighting would have been hot, continuous lights and families just having the best time with someone who I learned very quickly, is a storyteller and a raconteur, uh, just a wonderful, a wonderful human being. There are lots of things to listen out for in the following interview, and let me draw your attention to just a few. Uh, listen out for the flash powder story. It's very funny. Uh, the story of, uh, People retouching, lots of retouching stories from the 1940s and billiard ball complexions.

[00:01:31] . Doing multiple jobs in a day. He used to do three or four jobs in a day, and have the timing so accurate that could include photographing a wedding. He learned his craft. He's great.

[00:01:42] He's spent time creating images for press, looking for alternative, alternative images and looking for PR images that no matter how much a sub editor crops them, the brand or at least the story is still very much intact. He talks about the utter love of the job and appreciating what a privileged position photographers like ourselves are in every day of the week.

[00:02:07] He talks a little about the role of agencies and how they now manage messages from companies in a way that probably they never did. He talks about relationships and he talks about being positive and persistence. He also talks about the role of the Institute.

[00:02:24] Finally, he talks a little bit about photographers always being the fag end of everything, but in the end, what he talks about really, It's the love of his job and the love of his clients. 

[00:02:35] Why am I telling you all of this upfront? Well, this is a long interview, but the sound of Stuart's voice and the history that it represents, as well as the fact that he's more current than an awful lot of photographers who I know right now who are much younger, uh, but just, there's something in his, his entire manner that is captivating and enthralling, informative and useful. And so, although it's a long interview, I thought I'd just explain a little bit about why I found it so appealing and why I've left the edit almost entirely intact. I've removed a few lumps and bumps where we all managed to hit a microphone as we're gesticulating.

[00:03:16] So picture the scene, there's myself, Sean and Stuart sitting, in armchairs and on couches.

[00:03:27] And if you're wondering why it took me quite so long, this interview is actually, it goes back to February of this year, and why it took me quite so long to get it out, it was partly because there was a lot of of lumps to remove and partly because it was this trip, this interview, this podcast that I was returning home from when the Land Rover blew up.

[00:03:46] And frankly, I think there's a little bit of trauma there with a six and a half thousand pound bill to re, to replace and repair piston number two. I think my heart just, I needed a minute just to not recall it every single time I try to edit this particular podcast down. It's a wonderful interview. Please enjoy.

[00:04:06] I know it's quite long, um, but what an absolute legend. I'm Paul and this is the Mastering Portrait Photography Podcast. 

[00:04:32] So, firstly, Stuart, thank you for welcoming us into your home. We've driven quite a long way, uh, to come and see you. Sean, uh, recommended we speak to you, because the number of stories you have make even his collection of stories look Insignificant.

[00:04:48] And as we all know, Sean, The Footnote Conboy has more stories than any man I've ever met up until probably this, this moment in time. So to kick the conversation off, how did you become a photographer?

[00:05:05] Stuart: It was an unfortunate or fortunate chain of events because, um, I was at the Leeds College of Art in 1940, 41, and I had the desire and intention of being a commercial artist, which is now referred as graphic designer and at that time, being wartime, there was little advertising being done, and so, uh, perhaps I was not sufficiently talented, but I finished up working for a firm who were essentially photoengravers, but they had a commercial photography studio as well, and they were short of somebody to join them, and I went in there and became virtually an apprentice photographer. This was very interesting because at that time, again, there was very little commercial photography advertising being done, and so all our efforts, or most of our efforts, were centred on war work, which involved going round the factories and, uh, Photographing for record purposes, the input of the particular company. And in those days, I can tell you that that was not a very comfortable proposition because we were on total blackout, and therefore, all the fumes in the factory, whatever they were, had very little chance of escaping, so you've got the fumes and the heat, and then of course we were only Illuminating scenes with flash powder, which was an added hazard, and, and so Photography outside in the factories was not very pleasant, but inside the factory, or in the studio, we were also doing war work, and that was to photograph silhouettes, scale models of all aircraft of both the enemy and, uh, and, uh, Home, uh, Aircraft for identification purposes, so that the air gunners were not shooting our own planes down in action. And another very interesting thing which I have always remembered was that the four, or the eight cannons In the Spitfire, that was four in each wing, were harmonized to converge at a point away from the Spitfire so that the Fire, the maximum fire point was when those two lots of cannons converged.

[00:08:34] The only reference that the pilots had was a silhouette which we had photographed, so that he could visualize that silhouette in the, aiming sight of his 

[00:08:50] guns. 

[00:08:51] Paul: a very early heads up display. 

[00:08:53] Stuart: Indeed. 

[00:08:54] Paul: Yeah.

[00:08:55] Stuart: And, so, that was quite an important element, I think, of our war work for the Air Ministry.

[00:09:03] The main factory was engraving the, conical, rangefinder cones for 25 pound howitzers.

[00:09:14] Paul: Right.

[00:09:15] Stuart: And at the time of leaving school, everybody had to be doing war work. 

[00:09:21] And so I went to the company on the pretext of doing war work of that nature, rather than going round snapping.

[00:09:31] Paul: Right.

[00:09:32] Sean: Stuart, could you also, um, I mean you've told me many great tales about your time actually in the, uh, armed services film unit, i think that might be quite interesting, 

[00:09:42] Stuart: Well, I was called up and because of my interest in mechanical things and gadgetry and so forth, I finished up in the Royal Army Service Corps. But a friend of my mother's husband suggested that I applied for a trade test in photography. And one day I was called up to the orderly room and they said, We've got the movement order here for you. Um, to go to Pinewood Studios, of all places. I don't know what this is about, but anyway, here's your movement order. So, I went down to Pinewood, and we had a trade test, and I think I finished up, uh, top of the, the, uh, examination. But then I was returned to unit at Catterick, and I was up there for another few months, and then I was posted. And eventually, after about six weeks of the posting, I got another movement order to go back to Pinewood Studios, where I started my course in cinephotography,

[00:11:06] and still photography. Now, this was the last course. before Pinewood closed down and the unit closed down. I'm talking about Pinewood closing down, Pinewood was the headquarters of the Army Film and Photographic Unit from when it was formed in October 41.

[00:11:35] The course included preparation for action photography, essentially. when the course started, the war was still on in Central Europe. but before the course finished, it, uh, the war finished.

[00:11:58] And The Japanese War was still going on until September of the same year, which was 45. But we were still being trained, and when the course finished, we had very little to do but just wait to see what happened. And so from September to, um, December of that year, we were just hanging about in the studios.

[00:12:30] We were then posted to the Far East, in fact to Malaya, where the No. 9 unit was formed. Having been moved by Batten's headquarters, Mountbatten's headquarters, from Ceylon to Singapore, thought that it would be probably much more congenial there than in Ceylon, India.

[00:12:57] So number nine was there and it's interesting to note that right at this moment an exhibition is being produced for the photographer's gallery on Bert Hardy's life and Bert Hardy at the time that I there was, in fact, the stills captain in charge of all the still photography in Malay Command. Or the, not Malay Command, the Far East Command, because we had outstations in Java and Hong Kong, and even, uh, one guy, uh, was in, um, in Hiroshima. So that was the formation of the, the, uh, Far East, Southeast Asia Command photographic, uh, outfit. until it closed down, uh, in September, August September of 46, and we are then dispersed Some went to the Imperial War Museum, the Imperial, uh, war, graves Commission, et cetera, and six of us went back to Vienna, where we joined number 9, Public Relations, because unit had been disbanded completely. So, there in, uh, in Austria, we were doing what they call Local Boy Stories, and we made a couple of films on the Irish regiments and also the East Yorkshire, not the East Yorkshire, the Yorkshire regiments who were guarding and on guard duties at the palace, Shurnbran Palace, which everybody has heard of, and um, and so that carried on until, uh, the Until I was demobbed in 1947, December. came home and went back to the company I originally started with because they were compelled to take people for 12 months. And at the end of that time, I decided to leave I had a bit of a a difference of opinion with the studio manager, who was RAF, and I was Army, and I was a sergeant as well, and I don't think he was quite that when he was in the RAF photographic section, but there was a resentment anyway.

[00:16:02] of my presence. 

[00:16:03] So, I went to the firm called C. R. H. Pickards, who were one of the finest industrial, uh, and leading industrial photographic units, companies, in the north of England.

[00:16:24] It was there, then, that I began to learn industrial photography. And we photographed all sorts of various things, from factory engineering, factories, products and so forth, lathes, milling machines, railway engines, all manner of things. And that's where I cut my teeth on industrial photography.

[00:16:56] Sean: And, and Stuart, what sort of, um, equipment would you be using in those days? not 

[00:17:01] Stuart: so ha! 

[00:17:02] Sean: but how 

[00:17:03] would you be lighting these spaces in those days 

[00:17:05] Stuart: um The equipment that we were using was always, almost always, whole plate, six a half, eight by, eight and a half, six a half, uh, folding field cameras. when I started, we

[00:17:29] were on glass plates. But then the advent of film came in. And this was obviously much lighter stuff to carry around. And every, exposure had to count. Now in today's terms, where you press the button and pick the best out of however many, all we used to do was a duplicate at the most. So we used to There was a variation in the exposure or the aperture setting, and that was the only difference the two exposures.

[00:18:19] So what we used to do was develop one side of the, uh, the double dark slides, see what they were like, if they wanted a little bit more or a bit less development, that was applied to second side. And, don't know whether you've ever heard of the expression of, um, developing by, uh, vision. But we used to have a very dim green light, and the sensitive film.

[00:18:59] was not, uh, sensitive to the green light. 

[00:19:03] Paul: All right. 

[00:19:04] Stuart: But you had to be in the darkroom for ten minutes for your eyes to become adjusted, and you could then see absolutely every detail of the, the development process. And when the highlights started to you, to, To show a dark mark through the back of the antihalation backing, then the development was just about right, if but if you wanted a little bit more contrast, then you just pushed it on. If it had been a dull day, a dull, miserable day, then you pushed the development on a little bit further.

[00:19:49] Sean: And 

[00:19:49] Stuart: you've asked 

[00:19:50] Sean: be, how would you be lighting some of these scenes? I'm very intrigued at that 

[00:19:53] Stuart: I 

[00:19:53] Sean: that 

[00:19:53] Stuart: about to say that.

[00:19:54] Um, for big areas, we used to use flash powder. And a little bit of flash powder goes a long way, believe me. But it was pretty dangerous stuff. And um, I remember we photographed a wedding on one occasion at the Majestic Hotel Harrogate. And there were 450 people. at the reception and they wanted a photograph to show as many of the people as possible. So we put the whole plate camera on a table stood up there with tray into which I poured flash powder.

[00:20:38] Now then, this was actuated. with a percussion cap, like we used to have in little

[00:20:46] hand pistols for toys. and when you pulled the release catch, that ignited the cap,

[00:20:56] that ignited the flash powder.

[00:21:00] So, the exposure was only going to be once. One exposure.

[00:21:07] And so, the photographer I was with, he said, right everybody. Look this way, and I want to be making sure that everybody keeps still.

[00:21:21] I'm going to count five for you, but don't move until I've finished counting.

[00:21:29] So the idea was to take the sheath out of the slide. With having put a cap over the lens, shutter, just an open lens with a cap or a lid on the front.

[00:21:46] And the technique was to take the cap off hold it in front of the lens, so that that allowed the vibration or any vibration in the camera to settle down and then take the exposure. the idea was count 1, 2, 3, 4, then take the cup off. And on four I ignited the flash gun and then the cup went on and the guy that I was worth put the sheath back and said, right, let's get out of here quick. The reason for that was that you got the brightness, got the, the buildup of the available lights. then it's just topped off, illuminated with the flash, not a very big one, I hasten to add. But the significance of flash powder was that there was a flame which simply went upwards. 

[00:23:00] And that was it, that was all there was to be seen. But, it produced smoke, which used to go into, onto the ceiling, and it would roll across the ceiling, carrying with it the grains of the flash powder, which had obviously changed colour from

[00:23:24] silver

[00:23:25] To yellow, that was okay. But when the waiters came to move the, uh, soup plates, what they found was a white circle on a yellow 

[00:23:47] cloth.

[00:23:51] And you can also visualize the fact that a lot of people had a lot of. Little flash powder grains in their hair 

[00:24:01] as well. well. By the time that

[00:24:04] By the time that this happened, we were halfway back to Leeds. 

[00:24:08] Sean: Very good. 

[00:24:09] Stuart: But this this was the scourge of flash powder because you could only take one shot. Because the place used to, the whole of the place, the factory, if you using a large amount of powder, made a lot of smoke, and it just collected on the ceiling and it obscured it, the vision. So, we used to use photo floods, these were overrun pearl lamps, we used to have six on a button. And if the subject was still, we could go around on a long lead and paint scene with light. And that was, and that became established, So flash balder started to go,

[00:25:08] Paul: Right.

[00:25:10] Stuart: but you see, at this time, flash bulbs hadn't really got going.

[00:25:17] The GEC flash bulbs, which were foil filled, were about the only thing that was available. Um, in this, in this country. And they were sympathetic.

[00:25:31] And the GEC Warehouse in Leeds on one occasion, uh, a consignment of, um, bulbs came,

[00:25:43] Uh,

[00:25:44] in a, in a case, and, uh, one of the attendants decided that he would test them to see whether they were all alright.

[00:25:54] So

[00:25:54] he fired one.

[00:25:57] and 50 flashbulbs, because

[00:26:01] they had to be in contact with each other. If they were separate, it didn't work, but when you put them side by side, they were sympathetic.

[00:26:11] Paul: What

[00:26:11] happens? 

[00:26:13] Stuart: Well, the whole lot 

[00:26:14] went 

[00:26:14] off. A whole box full of, um, flashbulbs, and they weren't cheap at that time. 

[00:26:22] So 

[00:26:23] really, 

[00:26:23] that was, that was the basic equipment which we used to

[00:26:29] use.

[00:26:31] And

[00:26:32] it was all,

[00:26:33] it

[00:26:34] was all, uh, 8x6.

[00:26:37] Sometimes it was 10x8.

[00:26:41] The, uh, the railway engines, which we used to photograph for the Hunsley's Engine Company

[00:26:47] and hudderswell Clark's in Leeds, we always used to use 10x8 for those. Now it was interesting there because we used to have a particular date for going to photograph them. And

[00:27:04] they were all finished up in black, white and grey paint. Because that served the cost of retouching the finished print.

[00:27:15] There was very little photography done at that time. Apart from views and so forth. But anything that meant a machine, a lathe the, or whatever, it always had to go to the process retoucher who airbrushed the reflections or put one or two, put a shadow in or whatever it is. It was a highly skilled, uh, process. Uh, process, retoucher with white lines and so forth. But the interesting thing about these two railway engine companies was. that they only painted them on one side, the side that was being photographed.

[00:27:59] Paul: And

[00:28:01] Stuart: we used to go back to the studio, develop them straight away, yes, the negatives are alright, as soon as that happened, then they would strip all the black, white, and grey paint off and finish up in the customer's required, required colours.

[00:28:23] Paul: Wow.

[00:28:25] So, so the bit that strikes me is retouching has been part of this art 

[00:28:30] Sean: a long time. Well, 

[00:28:33] Paul: I mean, think about

[00:28:33] it, right? Because we, there's a lot of debate about retouching and post production. That rages. Even now, but when you think about a manufacturer only painting one side of a train, they're painting it colours that repro well, and then it's being handed on to a retoucher, retouching's been going on for a very long time. 

[00:28:51] Stuart: Well of course, everything at that time was, was, um, retouched, and most portraits finish up with complexions like billiard balls. There were no shadows, etc. 

[00:29:03] Paul: haha, It's like nothing's changed! 

[00:29:07] Stuart: Indeed. Indeed, and, and when people speak now in condemnation of, oh well you can see the retouching and so forth, well the only thing that you have to do now is to make sure that it doesn't show. But, it was, really when Photoshop and the like came in on the scene, this was manna from heaven.

[00:29:32] Paul: Yeah.

[00:29:33] Stuart: Because it cut out the need to do the work on the actual print. To retouch transparencies was a rather different process altogether.

[00:29:48] And it was 

[00:29:49] Sean: difficult process to be

[00:29:50] Stuart: Oh yes, and very highly skilled. And the firm that I worked for, Giltrous Brothers, who were the photo engravers, they used to retouch twenty, twenty

[00:30:02] four, twenty glass plates. Whereby, when you talk about printing today, and I think the, uh, top of the range, uh, Epson, Uh, printer works in, uh, we're printing 11 colors, but the, limited edition photolitho, uh, illustrations were, uh, certainly on, on 13 colors

[00:30:36] And from 13 separate plates. All of which were retouched.

[00:30:42] Paul: So

[00:30:42] the plates were retouched separately? 

[00:30:45] Stuart: correct? 

[00:30:45] Oh yes. 

[00:30:46] Paul: Wow.

[00:30:48] Stuart: So

[00:30:48] Paul: each of these plates is a black and

[00:30:49] white plate that's going to take one color ink?

[00:30:52] Sean: Correct. I understood the

[00:30:52] Paul: the process right?

[00:30:53] Sean: Yeah. 

[00:30:54] Stuart: process, right? Retouches were earning more than photographers at any time. 

[00:31:01] Sean: It's most interesting to hear this, Stuart, because you come into my era when I was learning photography and the discipline of the transparency, the 4x5 and 8 inch transparency, and of course there, retouching was an anathema because if we retouched the transparency, we started to lose some quality.

[00:31:17] Stuart: Yes. we to, it was a period of photography, I think, more than ever, when we had to get everything right in the camera because the client demanded the transparency. Whereas the processes you were using enabled this retouching method, which is very, very interesting.

[00:31:29] There are certain elements, as you well know, with your, even with your skills, whereby there are elements which cannot be lit out or exposed out or 

[00:31:43] whatever. And there has to be some artwork, or whatever you call it, retouching done. And at the end of the day, most of the photography which, which I was taking and involved with, was going to be reproduced. And so if it was retouched at source, before it got to the retouchers on the reproduction, uh, side.

[00:32:11] of the plate making, then that was, it was as we wanted it rather than what they thought it should be. 

[00:32:20] Paul: As ever photographers being control freaks. 

[00:32:24] Stuart: Well, after something like two to three years at Picards, by which time I got a fair amount of idea of what's going on. 

[00:32:37] Um, I decided that, um, I ought to seek pastures new and became a staff photographer for the 600 Group Of Companies just on the west side of Leeds. And there I photographed secondhand machinery, which they used to recondition and I photographed the, lathes and milling machines, drilling machines and that sort of thing, and they were then printed on and they, all these were taken on the half plate camera, which is half the size of a whole plate camera, obviously, um, and, um. they were made on 6x4 glossy prints, and these were distributed by the appropriate department to potential buyers. And I was there for three and a half years. But I'd got to the stage where I'd photographed everything that didn't move, and I was becoming rather dissatisfied with life. So I 

[00:33:49] Paul: Do you mind if I ask how old are you at this point?

[00:33:53] Stuart: this point? Well, let me see, I would be about, twenty, twenty four, twenty, what, twenty five. Right. Twenty five, six. 

[00:34:03] Paul: Right.

[00:34:04] Stuart: I was dissatisfied because I didn't think I was getting anywhere.

[00:34:09] Sean: So you were, you were ambitious, really, to take your photography on to another level and, and have more control, would you say, over what you were doing

[00:34:16] Stuart: you could say that, yes. just say to work for yourself, Stuart? 

[00:34:20] Sean: The Thing is that the, the company that I worked for. was part of the A. H. Leach corporate, uh, company at Brighouse, which was, uh, a very big organization with studios in Cambridge, Manchester, Glasgow. Um, and the prospects of moving to any one of those places was stalemate because they were well staffed was no flexibility for moving, and so I thought, well the only way to see whether I am a capable photographer was to make it on my own, see if I could make it on my own. And in fact started the business in some premises now occupied by the local library. down at the bottom end of the village.

[00:35:19] Stuart: But this was going on for some time, two or three years, and then the question of getting married.

[00:35:27] came into the reckoning, and this house in which we're sitting now became available, and very suitable because the front room lounge in which we now sit became my portrait studio.

[00:35:46] And across the top of the window, which is facing opposite you, was a bank of Kodak, um, lighting with five, four 500 watt lamps in each for general illumination.

[00:36:04] And So then I had a spotlight which is, was behind you for lighting the hair and then a fill in light on this side. And by this time, we'd moved on to two and a quarter square, real film cameras, 12 on 120.

[00:36:22] I hadn't really at that stage got into, back into the industrial scene because I was doing social photography, weddings and portraits, to build up a reserve of capital to move on to buying more advanced equipment.

[00:36:44] And the changes at that time were considerable. 5x4 were on the, on the fringe. At the time that I'm speaking of, German 9x12 plate cameras were still being used for press photography. And there they were, on the touchline at Heddingley, these, the local press photographers, with box of 9x12 single shot plates freezing to death, and um, and that's it, one off shots.

[00:37:26] But I missed the point earlier on, I think, of saying that uh, every shot had to count. And, over the years, that has influenced me considerably, because I've always made sure that everything was right before I took the exposure.

[00:37:48] And whatever the, whatever the occasion was, whether it was an industrial scene or a social scene, you look at the subject before you, to begin with, and then start looking round and see what's happening in the background. Because, if you do that, it saves retouching, and that's an absolute classical instance of today, where people, when Photoshop came, what about so and so?

[00:38:22] Oh, don't bother about that, I'll take it out. I can take it out in Photoshop, and I've heard speakers come to the Institute and talk about, Oh, I do this and do that, and I've said, well, how long does it take you to do that? Oh, well, a couple of hours or so, like that. It could have all been addressed in the taking, and that would have been eliminated.

[00:38:51] And when you talk about 2 or 3 hours retouching, well how much do you charge for, oh well I'll throw it all in.

[00:39:00] And the number of people who I've heard say that, oh well I'll just include it. I think they've got a bit wise to it now because Uh, any extramural activities are chargeable by the hour, and, uh, and it's certainly in need of that, but what I would say to any in, up and coming photographer, they need to sure of what it is that they're taking to avoid having to retouch it afterwards, albeit that in today's terms,

[00:39:40] With the relaxation of dress and disciplines and so forth, Um, I don't think it quite matters. And so, I think as far as today is concerned, I would find it difficult to go back to being a photographer in today's terms. Because, I can sit in a restaurant or in a room, somebody's room or whatever, and I'm looking at the, the vertical lines of the structure to, to see whether that line lines up with that, and it's surprising how often I can see lines that are out, even buildings.

[00:40:27] I could see buildings that, that were not, um, vertical. completely vertical and line up with the I sit there looking at the streets and doors and windows and it's very, it's very difficult to get out of that discipline into the much more free and relaxed attitude towards photography today.

[00:40:56] I don't know whether I, whether you would agree with that or not.

[00:41:00] Sean: Stuart, I would agree with what you're saying and it's like the photographer's eye, your whole life has been trained by your eye viewing scenes and viewing situations and it's quite impossible to turn that off really.

[00:41:10] That's part of you and how you see things, so no, I couldn't agree with you more. So Stuart, tell me, you obviously, the room we're in now was your studio, and you're in here, you're now married, you're doing more social photography, as you said, and obviously starting to make money. Where did the business go from there?

[00:41:29] What was your sort of next stage really? Because I believe you had another studio then in the village, is that correct? 

[00:41:35] Stuart: The children grew up and we were running out of room space,

[00:41:40] So an opportunity came in the main street down the road to take over a building, um, which I was able to use the ground floor and turn it into a studio, a reception studio and darkroom. And, uh, during that time, I was doing, um, mainly social photography, but also, I had got associated with the local newspaper which circulated in this area, and I virtually, without being on the strength, I virtually became the staff photographer for the whole of the circulation area.

[00:42:32] So on a Saturday in the summer, it was not unknown for me to do perhaps 11 cover 11 eventualities such as garden parties, a flower show, etc. and also fit in a complete wedding. So,

[00:43:00] Paul: So, 

[00:43:00] Stuart: so

[00:43:01] my time, my, my mind used to work like a, like

[00:43:07] a clock, uh, a precision clock, because it was, it was timed to the nth degree. Um, what time is the, uh, what time is the wedding? How long will the service be? Where's the reception? And I had a mental, uh, mental, uh, memo of the distance from here to there, and the length of time it takes to get from, from there to there.

[00:43:36] And, as far as the, as the newspaper is concerned, I tried to take a different picture. at each occasion, so that we don't want the same picture of women serving tea, uh, for the WI, the church of this and that and the other. Um, I tried to make a different picture. So that training and experience fitted me in good stead for when the industrial scene tailed off.

[00:44:15] Sean: I've just, uh, I've just, um, picked a photograph up here.

[00:44:18] Stuart's got quite a number of his photographs in the room with us here. It's a very nice PR, press type shot here of Harry Ramsden's Fish and Chips shop, and it's got a very 1980s mobile phone and the world famous in this part of the world, Nora Batty which some of you may know from a famous last of the summer wine tv show and i think this is to do with the flotation of Harry Ramsden because it became quite a successful company didn't it so talk a little bit about this photograph Stuart it's very captivating and i think very very well executed

[00:44:50] Stuart: Well, the story as you've already identified, I'm surprised that you have, because that was when they went public. And, uh, the, story was the Harry Ramsden fish restaurant, which, it was the center of all activities, just on the outskirts of Leeds, and they, as you said, they got Nora Batty there, who was a very leading personality at the time, and, of course, telephones, you can see the size of that, that mobile telephone, which is about the size of a half of a brick. Um, this was the, um, the story. And the essential thing was to locate the seed of the picture with the name of the, the company. across the top of the, the print or the format.

[00:45:46] Sean: And if I could just butt in there Stuart just to say sorry to do this but I think it's important to get this across that I've just picked this image up and the story has come straight across to me. We've got the mobile phone. You've got the Financial Times, which is holding the fish and chips. You've got the sort of banker type chap behind her.

[00:46:02] It just shows the skill that's gone into that picture, that an image is telling that story to me all these years later. Because I presume this photograph is 30 or 40 years old, Stuart. Am I correct there? 

[00:46:12] Stuart: It's quite a long time. And the essential thing about that picture, uh, Sean, is that however much a sub editor chops it down. There was always be something of the story there, because the nearest or the furthest down that they could chop it would be across the top of the bloke's head, but it would still say Harry on the left hand side.

[00:46:42] And, and, that was the, the art of, at that time, of getting the story across for public relations. Include the company's name or the brand in the background somewhere so that it had to be seen and it couldn't be taken out. 

[00:47:03] Paul: I ask you a question? Have you always loved being a

[00:47:06] Stuart: being a photographer? Oh, absolutely. 

[00:47:09] I wouldn't do anything else. Um, had a very enjoyable life in every aspect of it. And I'll tell you one thing about it, and Sean will agree with me on this. Photography, photographers are in a very privileged position, and they don't realize how much so. Because so often, they are in, at the ground floor of activity. A conference, a confidential conference projecting the aims of the company.

[00:47:46] I was in a company when I was in the conference actually, when the whole of the regional bank managers were in a conference at Harrogate, and they were told then, that we were going to dispose of the buildings, our assets, and I photographed several banks which were up for sale and they were simply being sold off. The managers didn't know. What's the photograph for? Oh, it's just for the estate. I knew what they were, why they were selling it. It was going on the market.

[00:48:25] You know all these little convenience grocery shops and so on, on filling stations, I was in the conference there for all the ESSO managers in the region, when the the project was put to them that we're going to put these little kiosks, or whatever it is, and, and, and there I was. Um, and we were privy to information that was light years ahead of the actual official announcement.

[00:48:59] Paul: Yeah.

[00:48:59] Stuart: Metahall, for instance, um, I was in the conference when they were talking about what their footprint was needed to be to make that viable. And there are several instances such as that. And you do get it to a more personal level, where we've got, uh, injuries, personal injuries to photograph.

[00:49:26] Oh well, what about Snow?

[00:49:29] Well,

[00:49:29] And you just can't get involved with passing that or repeating that information.

[00:49:35] Paul: Yeah.

[00:49:36] Stuart: It's confidential. And as I said, photographers are so often right in the heart of things. And I'm sure, Sean, that in today's terms, you'll be more exposed to it than I was with them.

[00:49:51] Sean: Well, very much so Stuart.

[00:49:52] Very much so. Yeah. I mean, it's, I can't tell you how many NDAs I've signed in my career, so, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. 

[00:50:00] So Stuart, so you've now got the studio, the, the biggest studio now on in the, in the, in the village here. And you're obviously doing your social, your weddings, you're obviously doing a lot of PR.

[00:50:11] Did you start to do, did the industrial photography come back a little bit more as well?

[00:50:15] Stuart: Yes But I was, I was extremely fortunate and the odd thing about it was that the connection came through the, uh, the work of the local paper because three miles from here was the control room for the Central Electricity Generating Board and they were having an open night and the local paper was invited to to cover the, the event. So I went along and took a few photographs of whatever was going on and had a bit of a look around the place and subsequently then I was approached by their, their public relations department for the northeast region. Would I take a photograph of something else? 

[00:51:13] From that stemmed the work, which really became the mainstay of my activities with the Central Electricity Generating Board.

[00:51:26] Again, I wasn't on the staff, but I was vir, virtually became the staff photographer for the Northeast Region. And the amazing thing is that here I was, photographing power stations, the grand openings of power stations, starting with Thorpe Marsh, which was the, down in Doncaster, which had two 400 megawatt sets, which were the f The Forerunner, they Thorpe Marsh was really the testbed for the, um, the 400 megawatt stations which followed.

[00:52:13] And there again, this was being in on the ground floor whenever there was a fault down there or whatever. or a problem, um, I was called in to, to, to take the photographs. 

[00:52:27] Sean: So

[00:52:28] Stuart, would you say that, um, he's very interesting listening to this about how your business built. Would you say that networking was a great part of building your business?

[00:52:37] Stuart: Networking, well they call it networking now, and it's, it's contacts really. And I think, I'm sure that you'll agree that being in the right place at the right time, and that really applies to anything, the theatrical world, et cetera, and, not necessarily knowing the people, the right people, but getting on with them, and being able to mix with people, and behave in a way that people expect you to. So 

[00:53:10] Sean: Would you have any sort of advice or tips for a young photographer or somebodnew breaking into photography and how to. build a business? Have you anything to add there at all? 

[00:53:22] Stuart: I think that in today's terms, it is extremely difficult for photographers. And I'll tell you why, because I think that the opportunities which I just mentioned are remote, probably remote in the extreme. Social photography is something else, and the, the website, and all the various media opportunities, with which I am unfamiliar and have no knowledge of because I've not had the need to do it. But I am aware because I look at what people are doing. And that's another instance of success. Of keeping an eye on what other people are doing. If you admire anybody's particular work, then that sets the example and the criteria to work to. But as far as going back to contact is concerned, I have the distinct impression now that not only photography, but everything now stems from public Relations and I don't know whether you've noticed it or not, but if there's, if there are any problems, on the one hand, of people's behavior or their activities, or whatever it may be, adversely or favorably, and the promotion of brands and industries and business, it all seems to stem now very much from the agencies. 

[00:55:12] If you read question of the so and so company are going to introduce this product or

[00:55:22] service or whatever it is, or they've taken over a business. the

[00:55:27] statements attributed to the managing director or chief executive or accountant or whatever it is, right across the board, a great many of the people that are being quoted, I would suggest, are not capable of speaking and thinking the way that the statement appears in print. And it raises sometimes, a lot of suspicion as to just what is behind this thing. This business with the post office. It's full of it. And so the point that I'm making is that advertising agencies, that's another one, the advertising agencies are in direct contact with the, um, with the brand or the company.

[00:56:24] And so the opportunities of the photographers, in my judgment, are minimized because of the hold. that the advertising agencies have on the job. 

[00:56:43] And 

[00:56:43] they, 

[00:56:45] they will say who they want and who should be employed. They may think them best or otherwise. And it also then comes down to, rights, and I bet you are right in the thick of this, that, uh, you are the, the favorite bloke on the, on the block, and whilst ever that person is engaged in that company, your situation is secure. But suddenly, if he goes to pastures new, and they've already got their established photographers, as far as you're concerned, you've lost that company.

[00:57:28] Sean: Very 

[00:57:28] Stuart: company. 

[00:57:29] Sean: very true. Yeah, yeah. 

[00:57:30] Stuart: Is it true?

[00:57:31] Paul: But there's always opportunities with these things, I mean, in the end, there are more photographs being created today than ever historically, I think you're right about the structures of advertising agencies, though this isn't my world, when someone moves on, there's an opportunity, and there's always the opportunity to stay as well, there is risk, of course there's risk, but equally, you could be the guy he takes with you.

[00:57:54] So how do you make that happen?

[00:57:56] Sean: Well, I think it's very apt because I've had two or three key clients in my career that have moved numerous times, you know, seriously big companies and they've taken me with them, yeah. And not only that, in some cases, they've taken me to their new company. And it's gone well. They've then moved on to another company and taken me with them, but the company they've left still retains me.

[00:58:19] So there's a benefit that way. But I think it's really, I greatly believe in the, in the networking, keeping in touch with people, making an effort at all times. And I think, I know we've got today's digital world and there's lots of advantages to that, but also personal contact I think is still really, really important.

[00:58:38] Relationships and personal contact.

[00:58:40] Stuart: What you are saying is, is correct. And I remember an uncle of mine who was a milkman and, had a, a big dairy, and he once said to my mum, oh, well, it's so and so, he's come again, a rep has come. It's been three times, so really it deserves an order.

[00:59:03] There's a 

[00:59:04] lot 

[00:59:05] Paul: in

[00:59:05] Stuart: a lot in

[00:59:06] truth in that, backs and it backs up what you were just saying, of keeping in contact, and, of course as far as advertising is concerned, or mail shots. the first one they take no notice of and throw away. The second one, oh well, there's another one from this so and so. The third one, it is usually reckoned that the person will be activated by that And so, as you said, keeping in contact is very important.

[00:59:42] But I'm bound to say that breaking in a lot of it is by accident, but certainly the persistence of contact is very important.

[00:59:56] And when you consider, you see, over the years we have thought of Only the Institute, or I have, and I've done, I've put a lot of time and work into it, as other people have, without which we might have been a lot more better off or a lot wealthier than we in fact are.

[01:00:20] Sean: Stuart, did, did, when we say the institute, it's the British Institute Professional Photography we're talking about here. And I, I'm a member too, and that's how I met Stuart through the institute. Through your long career as a photographer, how important did you find the, The Institute and the ability to mix and talk and, and, and work, you know, get information from other photographers, I suppose.

[01:00:41] How important did you find that 

[01:00:44] Stuart: Photographers, um, are, as you know, very, very much individualists. they work a lot on their own, and when you consider that there are probably 7 or 10, 000 practicing photographers in this country, and so few of them belong to anything. 

[01:01:10] It makes you wonder how all those people survive. but, it really comes back to, to, uh, what we were saying earlier, of contact, those people must be in contact with other people.

[01:01:29] Their reputation goes before them, obviously, and when you consider the situation with the Royals, for instance, who, from time to time, have official photographs taken, um, by names that I've never heard of, where you would perhaps expect that they are members of the, this organization, the Royal Photographic Society, as a case in point. Um, these people are not members of them and so how they I'm not talking about the Litchfields, I'm talking about the other people who officially, officially photograph, uh, in recent times, the, um, William and Kate's family, the, their birthday or whatever anniversary it was. So, those people, um, are plowing their own furrow.

[01:02:33] But going back to the the meaning of the institute, whereby people are individual, the opportunity over the past years was for all these individuals to rub shoulders with each other and the networking that went on then. For instance, you go to a meeting and you're chatting away, and a couple of blokes have a common, common interest, uh, uh, or they're equal practitioners, but suddenly, one of them comes up with a problem that he can't answer, and so he's able to phone this guy in Nottingham, or wherever, because he is not in competition down the street. He can't ask the guy down the street how to tackle the question, but the man in Nottingham will willingly bare his soul for you, and keeping in contact with, um, with other people to solve problems where they have them is incredibly useful, in my judgment. 

 

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